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View Full Version : 4020 took a dump. Ideas?


4x4dually
04-28-2014, 10:24 AM
Driving the 4020 the other day. Just left the cattle lot after putting out a hay bale. Mid RPM's in 5th gear, just cruising through the pasture road.

The engine let out a squeal, locked up, shut the entire tractor down in a quick second. After getting my ass back in the seat, I put it in park. I hit the starter and it turns over, just slower than normal....and seems a little out of balance.

What should I check first? Think I lost the cam gear off the front end? It acts like I don't have any fuel now. It won't even try to fire. Seems cam related.

Any advice before I spin my wheels on it?

iker42
04-28-2014, 10:29 AM
Tractor is green. Problem located.

4x4dually
04-28-2014, 10:30 AM
Aren't you a helpful little shyt today. :hehe:

Back in your hole.

97rada
04-28-2014, 10:39 AM
If you lost the can gear I would imagine there would be a lot of valve contact.


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DieselAddict1on
04-28-2014, 10:45 AM
Subscribed, have a 4020 motor job in my future as well.

90dodge
04-28-2014, 10:49 AM
I'll bring beer. Free couple days this week and this weekend.

crackerman
04-28-2014, 11:20 AM
The last 4020 i looked at that was fubar'd ended up being the rivet that holds the oil pump pickup screen onto the tube broken and half now wedged inside the oil pump. Oil pump is cam driven. You can see the drive gears on the passenger side ofhe engine by removing a plate or something else (i forget now) but they will be chewed to heck.

Cam gear spun on cam. It got a new cam and gear, oil pump, pickup, Broken rocker shaft and injector tip. I dont recall any valves needing replaced, but would figure on that as well.

4x4dually
04-28-2014, 11:33 AM
Oh God....I hope it don't turn into a full engine break down. I'm not savvy to all that jazz. I'm the king of bold on parts.....I ain't got time for internals. LOL

4x4dually
04-28-2014, 11:34 AM
I'm betting the power steering pump it what's locked and the cam gear spun. Is that even possible? LOL

will24
04-28-2014, 11:53 AM
Mine spun a #4 rod bearing one day running up the road with the discbine attached... pretty much same scenario... Pull the oil filter out first, then pull the pan and look for where the heat is concentrated

will24
04-28-2014, 11:53 AM
I'm betting the power steering pump it what's locked and the cam gear spun. Is that even possible? LOL


Not really, but it sounds good lol

zfaylor
04-28-2014, 11:58 AM
Found a 4020 repair kit for ya!

http://globalcarbrands.com/i/international/international-1066/international-1066-09.jpg

LOL actually liked our old 4020 besides the rock shaft leaking like crazy and the other small issues we had.

Sounds like its a bigger problem than you hoped though. :( 4020 are generally pretty reliable old tractors. Drain the oil and cut the filter open. Look for shiny scrap goodies.

99GreenCummins
04-28-2014, 05:51 PM
Hydraulics still work? I've seen hydraulic pumps lock up and kill tractors. Hard to imagine losing a cam gear and there not be any premature signs of failure.

Dane
04-28-2014, 06:14 PM
4020 injector oil pump drives from the rear of the cam , the drive gears tend to wear out and the oil pump and injector pump don't turn. there is a cover on the side of the injector pump with 2 flat head screws on it ( about 1/2 in. x 1 in.) . remove the cover . remember diesel fuel inside will spill out , you will be able to see if the pump rotates thru this small slot when the motor is turned , another thought broken crank. Dane

4x4dually
04-29-2014, 07:10 AM
Thanks. I'm leaning toward the hyd pump since the steering wheel gave me a shake when it died. Just a hunch. I'll drag it up to the shop in a day or two after I get T-ball practice over with. I need to work on my batting.

zstroken
04-29-2014, 09:26 AM
How many hours on it?

Thegrampatrk
04-29-2014, 09:32 AM
ill bring the race truck and while you wire it ill tear the 4020 apart???

4x4dually
04-29-2014, 09:55 AM
How many hours on it?

Gauge has been stuck on 8400 hrs....since I bought it in 2004. LOL

ill bring the race truck and while you wire it ill tear the 4020 apart???

Hmmmmm....now that sounds enticing. I'm just afraid that if it required pulling the head and doing internal work that I won't be able to do it. But I can wire a race truck. ;)

99GreenCummins
04-29-2014, 12:02 PM
Thanks. I'm leaning toward the hyd pump since the steering wheel gave me a shake when it died. Just a hunch. I'll drag it up to the shop in a day or two after I get T-ball practice over with. I need to work on my batting.

That's where I would start. Pumps are notorious for causing issues on those tractors. They either kill the engine or the engine keeps running and the splines are broken off the input shaft. And they are easy to rebuild and parts aren't horribly priced.

TheSilverBullet
04-29-2014, 12:14 PM
unbolt the coupler for the hydraulic pump and see if it will run. its an aluminum 2 piece clamp on the crankshaft pulley with 2 bolts through it.

sidenote our 4020 has 18,000 hours on the original motor and yes she is tired lol

9724VF350
04-29-2014, 12:25 PM
Tractor is green with yellow wheels. Problem located.


Fixed.


Found a 4020 repair kit for ya!

Not my first choice, but fairly high up on the list.


I really don't have anything useful to add. LOL

Do they have adapters to put 5.9"s in these things?

4x4dually
04-29-2014, 12:34 PM
I found a repair kit. Since I'm on the wagon right now, I don't need it to light any smokes. LOL

http://www.northescambia.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/09/tractor-fire-20.jpg

TheSilverBullet
04-29-2014, 12:52 PM
4020s have been a damn good tractor and probably one of the most used tractors ever period

zfaylor
04-29-2014, 02:07 PM
4020s have been a damn good tractor and probably one of the most used tractors ever period

No doubt but the 3 we have owned over the past 10 years has taken me to the conclusion that theyre beginning to end up like 2nd gen dodges. They're either 12 grand and perfect or they're under 8 grand flat ragged out LOL

Our 966 has made my dad convert to the red side (the better side). We went from 4 green tractors to 5 red ones for hay :cheer:

4x4dually
04-29-2014, 02:08 PM
They're either 12 grand and perfect or they're under 8 grand flat ragged out LOL

Truth. Very little middle road 4020's left.

90dodge
04-29-2014, 02:21 PM
You need something like this.. We have a little over 4500 in it now.

http://img.tapatalk.com/d/14/04/30/ysa6a6yh.jpg

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4x4dually
04-29-2014, 02:26 PM
No. You are incorrect. I need something with a CAB and AIR CONDITIONING and MFWD! That is what the hell I need. LOL

90dodge
04-29-2014, 02:30 PM
Lol there is a difference between need and want.

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zfaylor
04-29-2014, 02:31 PM
No. You are incorrect. I need something with a CAB and AIR CONDITIONING and MFWD and CVT and AUTOSTEER and HEATED SEAT and a nice boombox! That is what the hell I need. LOL

Fixed it for ya :D

Heck you got a nice truck you can afford a new tractor surely :hehe:

4x4dually
04-29-2014, 02:32 PM
Lol there is a difference between need and want.

Jesus, Juan. Have you been seeing my wife behind my back? WTF!?!?!?!?!?

And how does that apply to your diesel jet boat? Exackary.

:lolly:

90dodge
04-29-2014, 02:35 PM
Hahaha Im just saving you a tractor payment!

Im not worried about wife or kids right now, i got toys to keep me company. LOL

don't tell allie i said that.

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4x4dually
04-29-2014, 02:47 PM
Thankfully, it has mid-mount hydraulic controls on the loader and it crapped out with the bucket in the air. Thankfully, they will remain aloft no matter what I have to take off of it. The loader has never been removed since I bought it. I'm sure that would be a crap load of fun it if becomes necessary. :(

cmann250
04-30-2014, 10:04 AM
If you're still thinking cam issues, it sounds reasonable to me.

I once fixed a tractor that "just stopped" and found it stripped 1/3 of the cam gear's teeth. Eight of twelve push rods were bent, but all twelve valves were ok. It turned over really easy because only two cylinders were holding compression. It's been a while, but if your cam isn't moving, I don't think your injection pump will either.

crackerman
04-30-2014, 10:17 PM
No. You are incorrect. I need something with a CAB and AIR CONDITIONING and MFWD! That is what the hell I need. LOL

Sounds like its time for a 4240.

will24
04-30-2014, 10:54 PM
Sounds like its time for a 4440.


Fixed it for ya ;)


Sent from my flashscan v2

Mr.T
04-30-2014, 11:13 PM
Fixed it for ya ;)


Sent from my flashscan v2

Why would he want a JD that's well known to spontaneously combust? Lol

Mr.T
04-30-2014, 11:28 PM
I'll help you pick the correct color of tractor Mr. Mustache man. :D

http://img.tapatalk.com/d/14/05/01/7yqa2ysu.jpg

http://img.tapatalk.com/d/14/05/01/8uqa4ezu.jpg

Either one is acceptable

dieselracer07
05-01-2014, 08:44 AM
Time for 4430!!! Best tractor ever made IMO
http://img.tapatalk.com/d/14/05/01/2apegehe.jpg

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4x4dually
05-01-2014, 09:09 AM
Time for 4430!!! Best tractor ever made IMO


I'm down with that. :D Spent many a years in one.

I also drove spent a lot of time in an Allis 8050. Biggest POS I've ever drove.

zfaylor
05-01-2014, 09:36 AM
Orange tractors LOL

90dodge
05-01-2014, 09:53 AM
I'd rather have a 50 series over the 30 or 40.

will24
05-01-2014, 10:02 AM
I'd rather have a 50 series over the 30 or 40.

Take it a step further... 4455s bring more money now than when they were new, for a reason!

90dodge
05-01-2014, 10:05 AM
Ive been driving a 4250, 4450, and 4455 for the past two years working for my boss. I think he has had more problems with the 55 than the other two. Electronic dash and what not. Seeing that the drivetrain is identical in all of them i don't see the reason in buying the newer. Just saying..

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Mr.T
05-01-2014, 11:12 AM
Orange tractors LOL

Orange TTFMF! Haha

Signature600
05-01-2014, 12:00 PM
Orange TTFMF! Haha

Some people just don't know any better....and those people drive green and yellow.



Jory, I don't know of anything off hand, but if you need anything yell. I may be able to find you parts reasonable.
Chris

4x4dually
05-01-2014, 12:21 PM
Some people just don't know any better....and those people drive green and yellow.



Jory, I don't know of anything off hand, but if you need anything yell. I may be able to find you parts reasonable.
Chris

Thank you sir. I still have your cell number as long as it is still the same. ;)

I do need a power steering pump for a 1989 GMC 7000 Detroit 6.2L with air if anyone has a lead. Local diesel repair shop said, "um, we can't find anything. "

90dodge
05-01-2014, 12:22 PM
I do believe i just found a new Sig quote. Lol

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TheSilverBullet
05-01-2014, 12:23 PM
Ive been driving a 4250, 4450, and 4455 for the past two years working for my boss. I think he has had more problems with the 55 than the other two. Electronic dash and what not. Seeing that the drivetrain is identical in all of them i don't see the reason in buying the newer. Just saying..

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I727 using Tapatalk

agree less electronics makes a more reliable tractor. but the 30 40 series are just worn out anymore and 50 series are getting close. been looking for a decent 440 and and its proving impossible for a decent priced one. What people pay for 20-30 year old tractor is insane

4x4dually
05-01-2014, 12:25 PM
I do believe i just found a new Sig quote. Lol

I'd say come over tonight and we'll look into the tractor....but I gotta go wire a barn at 86 and 51. The new army surplus building. Maybe sometime Saturday if you are out and about. I need help pulling it up to the house. It is dead down by the working chutes.

If you are traveling 51 later this evening, stop by the new barn. Park around back. The overhead door will be open.

90dodge
05-01-2014, 12:25 PM
I found a burnt up 4230 i have been thinking about buying. Cab burnt everything else is good.

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4x4dually
05-01-2014, 12:30 PM
I found a burnt up 4230 i have been thinking about buying. Cab burnt everything else is good.

Well, according to YOU....cabs are WANTS not NEEDS.


:hehe:


asswipe


:hehe:

90dodge
05-01-2014, 01:24 PM
Ill call you when Im off work. And ya id toss the cab. Lol

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Signature600
05-02-2014, 09:20 AM
Thank you sir. I still have your cell number as long as it is still the same. ;)

I do need a power steering pump for a 1989 GMC 7000 Detroit 6.2L with air if anyone has a lead. Local diesel repair shop said, "um, we can't find anything. "

Absolutely is. Had it since 1999, can't change now.

Call anytime.
Chris

90dodge
05-02-2014, 09:36 AM
Absolutely is. Had it since 1999, can't change now.

Call anytime.
Chris

Can you find a turbo kit for that 756 in one of the previous posts?

DieselAddict1on
05-02-2014, 10:54 AM
Who sells a good compete engine rebuild kit for these?

will24
05-02-2014, 11:09 AM
All states sells a complete kit for a 4020. Between $1150 and $1300 depending on serial number and whether or not you want crank seals etc


Sent from my flashscan v2

4x4dually
05-02-2014, 12:22 PM
I'm sure Abiline Machine has the kits....but after some of the stuff I've bought from them, I doubt I buy any more. Their quality is horrible.

Thegrampatrk
05-02-2014, 11:07 PM
jori if you get serious about the motor rebuild and or a patch up and need help let me know ill be in and out for the next week but then ill be in stilly for the weekends and ks on the week days

zstroken
05-03-2014, 06:33 AM
I'm sure Abiline Machine has the kits....but after some of the stuff I've bought from them, I doubt I buy any more. Their quality is horrible.

Agreed, I know of two folks who had bad purchases from them.

Big Boy Toys
05-03-2014, 06:52 AM
There is a super clean powershift 4555 mfwd for sale near me, 1432hrs on it for a mere 75,000bucks!!! Damm nice tractor but that's a lot of coin. lol

will24
05-03-2014, 08:40 AM
There is a super clean powershift 4555 mfwd for sale near me, 1432hrs on it for a mere 75,000bucks!!! Damm nice tractor but that's a lot of coin. lol


Sadly, it will bring it! Take a look at the machinery Pete page for some crazy numbers!


Sent from my flashscan v2

Big Boy Toys
05-04-2014, 01:33 AM
Ya some of the stuff he covers brings some big money. I've got a soft spot for those tractors but not $75,000 worth of soft spot! lol

Signature600
05-04-2014, 10:00 AM
Can you find a turbo kit for that 756 in one of the previous posts?

I doubt that. Your best bet there is going to be a junkyard engine to take all the stuff off of.

Who sells a good compete engine rebuild kit for these?

Get me the serial number and I can get you a price. There are a few ranges for them.

I'm sure Abiline Machine has the kits....but after some of the stuff I've bought from them, I doubt I buy any more. Their quality is horrible.

Yeah, trash.

What I use on older tractors like that is Hy-Capacity. I've used them for years, good stuff, and good people. Have a warranty on parts, and labor on certain items, and rarely do we have any trouble.

Chris

CGD
05-04-2014, 03:19 PM
Found a 4020 repair kit for ya!

http://globalcarbrands.com/i/international/international-1066/international-1066-09.jpg


I have nothing to add here other than I want a black stripe in the worst possible way.

Sent from My phone while the Boss wasn't looking.

mfsuper90
05-05-2014, 12:36 PM
So back to the problem, what happened?

Ive seen bolts fall out of the flywheel and get bound up or break the flywheel and cause all sorts of hell.

4x4dually
05-05-2014, 12:45 PM
I got sick Thursday night and am still recovering. I haven't made it down to figure it out yet. I might not even get to it this week. I've got too much crap to do betwinxt now and Saturday.

zfaylor
05-05-2014, 01:19 PM
I have nothing to add here other than I want a black stripe in the worst possible way.

Sent from My phone while the Boss wasn't looking.

Agreed! Luckily I have a 560 and a 966 to paint this year. They will definitely get something like this :rockwoot:

haloman
05-05-2014, 04:20 PM
4 pages and no one suggested its a bad ground. You guys are slipping.



It's a bad ground.

4x4dually
05-06-2014, 07:50 AM
4 pages and no one suggested its a bad ground. You guys are slipping.



It's a bad ground.

That's because they didn't have grounds in '68. It was all virtual power back then. If you reverse the sinusoidal fam in the altimider, the system thinks it is grounded when in fact it is only a mock 3 phase. Swap any two phase conductors and the blinkers will blink the opposite direction.

Dtruck1
05-06-2014, 08:22 AM
That's because they didn't have grounds in '68. It was all virtual power back then. If you reverse the sinusoidal fam in the altimider, the system thinks it is grounded when in fact it is only a mock 3 phase. Swap any two phase conductors and the blinkers will blink the opposite direction.
:hehe:
That and they didn't have fuel shut off solenoids until the console models.

will24
05-06-2014, 10:13 AM
:hehe:
That and they didn't have fuel shut off solenoids until the console models.

It is weird how they jumped around with that... our 69 side console 4020 has the solenoid but the way newer 2640 still has the lever...

fox
05-06-2014, 12:14 PM
That's because they didn't have grounds in '68. It was all virtual power back then. If you reverse the sinusoidal fam in the altimider, the system thinks it is grounded when in fact it is only a mock 3 phase. Swap any two phase conductors and the blinkers will blink the opposite direction.

Does that mean the on is off and off is on???
LMAO!!!!

fox
05-06-2014, 12:16 PM
Driving the 4020 the other day. Just left the cattle lot after putting out a hay bale. Mid RPM's in 5th gear, just cruising through the pasture road.

The engine let out a squeal, locked up, shut the entire tractor down in a quick second. After getting my ass back in the seat, I put it in park. I hit the starter and it turns over, just slower than normal....and seems a little out of balance.

What should I check first? Think I lost the cam gear off the front end? It acts like I don't have any fuel now. It won't even try to fire. Seems cam related.

Any advice before I spin my wheels on it?

Sounds like it ran out of oil!!!!

zfaylor
05-06-2014, 12:20 PM
Sounds like it ran out of oil!!!!

oil?! I have found once you get past a certain point in life you stop worrying about things like that LOL if I don't check the oil in everything myself dad would have everything blown up in a hurry.

Seriously though have ya checked the oil level yet??

4x4dually
05-06-2014, 12:26 PM
Does that mean the on is off and off is on???
LMAO!!!!

No. If you swap any two phases, it will just reverse. If you put on the left blinker, the right one will come on and vice versa. :hehe:

Oil showed to be good. Middle of the "good" zone on the dipstick. I'm feeling better today. I might get it up to the shop in the next day or two. I can finally walk half way normal today.

4x4dually
06-09-2014, 07:11 AM
Got the ol' slug pulled up to the barn yesterday.

Hyd pump is ok. We uncoupled it and it spins ok and pumps.

Took inspection plate off IP. The lower half of the IP is not turning, meaning, the top part with the timing mark is visible, but the lower half of it will not spin at all when being cranked. Also, took off an injection line....no fuel when cranking. Fuel feed to the IP is good as it will squirt using the manual priming pump.

So.....it is either cam gear broke, the cam itself snapped somewhere, or the oil pump/inj pump drive is toasted.

I think I'll pull the valve cover and watch the valves when cranking. I should be able to tell the status of the cam doing that. I have a feeling the first couple cylinders worth of valves or so will move....and the back half won't. If it all moves, I'll have to pull the IP and take a look at the bottom of it. Maybe I just lost the oil pump. Who knows. All I see is $$$ signs.

4x4dually
06-09-2014, 01:24 PM
Apparently, the IP shaft has a "fuse" machined into it, a small diameter spot were it can shear if the pump locks up and keep the failure from taking out cam and gears.

http://thumbs4.ebaystatic.com/d/l225/m/m1d2xUDO0QAzJjH2V_CM9Hw.jpg

I was told that I could take the four bolts out of the speed/hour meter housing and look down into it and see the cam and gears. If those are good and turn with the starter....the IP shaft is toast. Probably due to dirt getting in it or something.

Anyone had this failure and have words of wisdom?

Also taking recommendation for those qualified shops that can fix/rebuild this pump if it is toast. The new shafts can be had for $100 or so. Anyone recommend someone that can rebuild Roosa Master pumps?

zstroken
06-09-2014, 02:31 PM
I think Northeast diesel can.

4x4dually
06-09-2014, 02:33 PM
It will please me to pull the pump and get it rebuilt.........instead of the in-frame rebuild I was fully expecting. I pray it is all in the IP....even though they are $1000+ new if I can't get it rebuilt for less.

Knoberman
06-09-2014, 05:13 PM
I would think any pump shop could handle it, do you have one local? if you have to ship it anyway call Seth.

4x4dually
06-09-2014, 06:41 PM
IP seems good. Cam and oil pump....not so much. Back of oil pump gear is smooth and the cam gear doesn't have any teef left. This sucks.

Found them. LOL

http://img.tapatalk.com/d/14/06/10/vupy2any.jpg


From dumb phone.

mikmaze
06-09-2014, 07:22 PM
cam gear needs dentures........

crackerman
06-09-2014, 08:04 PM
Did you look inside the oil pump yet? Or take pan off?

ThisPreston
06-09-2014, 10:23 PM
Look around for a complete 404 before you drop too much in parts at JD. We put a 7700 turbo engine in a gas 4020 this winter for ****s. Bought it complete for $800.

Sent from my SCH-I545 using Tapatalk

4x4dually
06-10-2014, 07:15 AM
Look around for a complete 404 before you drop too much in parts at JD. We put a 7700 turbo engine in a gas 4020 this winter for ****s. Bought it complete for $800.

I'd love to find a complete runner with a turbo for $800. That'd be tits. I'm not that lucky.

4x4dually
06-10-2014, 08:02 AM
Did you look inside the oil pump yet? Or take pan off?

Not yet. Maybe tonight. It is out in the other barn that is not enclosed. I hate to pull it all apart out there and leave it set in the moisture uncovered.

wcshale
06-10-2014, 08:09 AM
Not yet. Maybe tonight. It is out in the other barn that is not enclosed. I hate to pull it all apart out there and leave it set in the moisture uncovered.

Moisture? What moisture? I don't understand, you act like its rained or something. :poke:

4x4dually
06-10-2014, 08:12 AM
Moisture? What moisture? I don't understand, you act like its rained or something. :poke:

We go from a class D5 drought to 7.19 inches in the last 14 days. I'm good with that. ;)

Hell yes.

http://www.competitiondiesel.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=51549&stc=1&d=1402405953

wcshale
06-10-2014, 08:14 AM
We go from a class D5 drought to 7.19 inches in the last 14 days. I'm good with that. ;)

Hell yes.

http://www.competitiondiesel.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=51549&stc=1&d=1402405953

We need ours spread out through august.

4x4dually
06-10-2014, 08:16 AM
We need ours spread out through august.

You know it. But, like I said in Church, we didn't specify "can we get 1 inch per week for 7 weeks." We just prayed for rain. Then we got it. So we'd better shut up and enjoy it before it is gone. LOL

wcshale
06-10-2014, 08:21 AM
Yeah, its probably gonna stop, then I will have to go to work, wont have time to play on the computer no more.

4x4dually
06-10-2014, 08:31 AM
Hell yes.....HOOD STACK!!! LOL

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wkwlMZzCxes

Dtruck1
06-10-2014, 03:56 PM
I don't know why the name of that vid is like that. They were talking about selling deere engines to repower.

Dane
06-10-2014, 09:50 PM
IP seems good. Cam and oil pump....not so much. Back of oil pump gear is smooth and the cam gear doesn't have any teef left. This sucks.

Found them. LOL

http://img.tapatalk.com/d/14/06/10/vupy2any.jpg


From dumb phone.

I want my gold star LOL

4020 injector oil pump drives from the rear of the cam , the drive gears tend to wear out and the oil pump and injector pump don't turn. there is a cover on the side of the injector pump with 2 flat head screws on it ( about 1/2 in. x 1 in.) . remove the cover . remember diesel fuel inside will spill out , you will be able to see if the pump rotates thru this small slot when the motor is turned , another thought broken crank. Dane

4x4dually
06-11-2014, 08:28 AM
I want my gold star LOL

Here you go, Dane.


http://thewindsbeachclub.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/08/The-Winds-Resort-Gold-Star-Of-Excellence.jpg


:hehe:

99GreenCummins
06-11-2014, 11:53 AM
We just got one in our shop today with the same issue. Talked to the mechanic who is very experienced in those 20 series Deere's. Says normally this kind of issue all starts from a locked up oil pump.

Oh, there's 4 cam shaft options so engine has to be torn down to find correct one.

4x4dually
06-11-2014, 12:10 PM
We just got one in our shop today with the same issue. Talked to the mechanic who is very experienced in those 20 series Deere's. Says normally this kind of issue all starts from a locked up oil pump.

Oh, there's 4 cam shaft options so engine has to be torn down to find correct one.

Thanks, Todd. Since the oil pump gear is only bald on one side, I figured it had to lock up. Then the cam just spun and ate itself. Yes, there are a lot of cams for this SOB. I'll do a full tear down before I order anything. There might be worse problem when I get in it.

Question for your mechanic: Can the cam be replaced without pulling the head? Can I hold the followers up with something while I pull the cam then pull them out the bottom with the pan off? I notice a little hole in the followers. I'm assuming a person can use a piece of wire for each one with a hook on the end?

Any info would be great. I have the service manual from Deere (a neighbor had one) but it isn't much more in depth than the I&T. Still leaves a lot of tips out.

Dane
06-11-2014, 08:03 PM
You can replace the cam with the head on ,12 strong extendable magnetes , some rubber bands, a little ingenuity you'll be able to hold the followers up out of the way while you remove the cam. Dane

99GreenCummins
06-11-2014, 10:51 PM
I'll ask him. As mentioned I'm guessing it can be done but I'm not sure. Probably be best to pop off a rod and main cap to see what kind of shape the bearings are in. May need a full rebuild as well.

The one in our shop somehow lost the oil pickup screen, sucked a large chuck of steel(size of a ball point pen tip) into the oil pump and stopped right now.

Call your local Deere dealer, they should be able to order a full technical manual with good pictures and full torque specs. May take 1.5-2 weeks to receive because Deere prints them as ordered but they are super nice to have.

4x4dually
06-12-2014, 07:58 AM
My neighbor has an actual Deere manual, but it is for serial 201,000 and up. I think mine is 173xxx or 183xxx. Should be close.

I'm certain no one recommends using the original followers with a new cam, correct? 12 ea @ $12 each. Assuming that is a must?

99GreenCummins
06-12-2014, 12:06 PM
That's cheap insurance for an expensive part that's a pain to replace.

4x4dually
06-12-2014, 12:51 PM
Agreed. I'm going to look into having the IP ran through and a rebuild kit for the hyd pump while it is all torn down as well. The cam alone at the dealer would hit 3 grand easy. I'd rather spend a grand or so on parts and figure out the labor on my own even if it takes me a month. I just need to find a magnetic follower holder set that I can borrow or rent. :D

99GreenCummins
06-12-2014, 04:57 PM
After talking to the the mechanic, you can pull the cam without totally removing followers. He did say it's much easier if you remove the head since the passages are so small on the head.

4x4dually
06-13-2014, 08:31 AM
Ya, it takes a set of magnetic follower holders. I've found them in the book. I need to find a set to borrow or rent I guess.

4x4dually
06-16-2014, 08:33 AM
Where the hell does a person find something like this?

D-15001NU Magnetic Holding Tool Set

Still can't find where to buy one. All I can find online is the name. No link to the tool.

Google is failing me.

4x4dually
06-16-2014, 08:43 AM
Need.

http://www.competitiondiesel.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=51635&stc=1&d=1402926177

06 DIESEL
06-16-2014, 11:23 AM
Why wouldn't a few of these work?

http://www.harborfreight.com/18-inch-telescoping-magnet-37187.html

4x4dually
06-16-2014, 12:15 PM
Why wouldn't a few of these work?

http://www.harborfreight.com/18-inch-telescoping-magnet-37187.html

I've thought about that. I'll have to pull the push rods and see how large the holes in the head are. I think they are pretty dang small.

ThisPreston
06-16-2014, 03:17 PM
I've got a 5.9 JD gas engine in the corner of the shed that I can ship down to you. Not only would it be an upgrade, the women would flock to you from miles around. Think about that.

Sent from my SCH-I545 using Tapatalk

4x4dually
06-16-2014, 03:39 PM
I've got a 5.9 JD gas engine in the corner of the shed that I can ship down to you. Not only would it be an upgrade, the women would flock to you from miles around. Think about that.


Upgrade? No, a new cam plus a turbo would be an upgrade. LOL

Who's got the turbo layin' around and the alternate exhaust manifold?

will24
06-16-2014, 06:19 PM
Upgrade? No, a new cam plus a turbo would be an upgrade. LOL



Who's got the turbo layin' around and the alternate exhaust manifold?


4320 manifold! Check with Wenger in myerstown, pa.


Sent from my flashscan v2

will24
06-16-2014, 06:20 PM
Just checked their site quick, they have the manifolds in stock but they're salty


Sent from my flashscan v2

crackerman
06-16-2014, 08:19 PM
Eh, its farm equipment. Just joesixpack it!

4x4dually
08-01-2014, 11:53 AM
Welp...she is broke down. I took her too a green paint repair guy. Should be going back together today.

Not sure exactly how it made two off-set versions of push rods. The crank to cam gear was fine and it never lost time. I'm lost.

http://www.competitiondiesel.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=52261&stc=1&d=1406911905

Red Sleeper
08-11-2014, 02:26 PM
How else do push rods get bent in stock form besides timing loss?

So what parts were damaged? Push rods, cam.. What else is being replaced?

4x4dually
08-12-2014, 07:43 AM
How else do push rods get bent in stock form besides timing loss?

So what parts were damaged? Push rods, cam.. What else is being replaced?

You got me? I have no idea. I'm pretty sure the cam-n-crank gears didn't jump off and then right back on to having the dots aligned. I was driving in 5th about 1400 rpm or so and it locked up dead immediately. Not sure if the force could have done it but I have no earthly idea how it could have.

Parts:

New/used oil pump (old one would lock every 180 deg)
New Cam and followers
A few new push rods
Hyd oil pump rebuild (doing it since it is torn down)

I told him to also put a new gasket or seal on everything he took off. I'm tire of leaks. Kinda wishing I would have told him to put a new head gasket on it too, but I have to stop the bleeding at some point. I'm sure there will be a grand in just parts by the time we figure all the fluids and filters too.

6.4 F-350
08-12-2014, 07:50 AM
The only time I have saw push tubes bend with out losing time is when a valve hangs open and the piston closes it, had it happen in a C model cat. It made a mell of a hess, bent all off the push tubes, bent the rocker shaft and broke 2 rockers.

BRE
08-12-2014, 08:31 AM
Jory... What have you done?

4x4dually
08-12-2014, 08:33 AM
Jory... What have you done?

I blew her up apparently.

BRE
08-12-2014, 08:34 AM
I blew her up apparently.


Cummins swap?

4x4dually
08-12-2014, 08:35 AM
Dude....you are waaaay behind. Hopefully I write a huge check this week and get her back. I got schidt to do.

BRE
08-12-2014, 08:49 AM
Dude....you are waaaay behind. Hopefully I write a huge check this week and get her back. I got schidt to do.


No I read it all... I just figured a cummins swap was the Murica thing to say.

Mr.T
08-12-2014, 09:02 AM
Cummins swap into a JD? that's a paddlin'

BRE
08-12-2014, 09:12 AM
Cummins swap into a JD? that's a paddlin'


Be better than what was in it...

4x4dually
08-12-2014, 09:20 AM
When my kids move off to College and pay their own bills...only then will I have time to do something cool like that.

Red Sleeper
08-12-2014, 12:33 PM
When my kids move off to College and pay their own bills...only then will I have time to do something cool like that.

My grandpa would always tell me, "you either have time or you have money. Never both."

4x4dually
09-10-2014, 10:58 AM
My 4020 is finally done. I'll pick it up tonight if it doesn't rain. Total bill is $2980.

And now he tells me the injection pump is about to go out. It could have been sent off sometime in the 9 weeks it took to fix the rest of it I'm pretty sure. I told him to never mind that I'd fix that myself. I got schidt to do. Just need it back.