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Mopar Man
07-11-2008, 10:16 AM
I would like some info on your Helix 2 Cam for the truck in my sig. What are the pros & cons? I am looking to lower EGT's, Clear up some smoke (Smoke is realy frowned on hear in southern CA) & maby spool the turbo a little quicker. I was told that this cam was the way to go. So could you give me what ever info you can & maby some pricing? TIA.

dzlfarmboy
07-11-2008, 10:37 AM
Helix 2: The Helix 2 is the best choice for just about all high performance applications. Single turbocharger and twin turbocharger engines will both benefit. Large reductions in maximum exhaust gas temperatures and smoke are immediately noticed. Increased throttle response and pulling power. Lift is higher and duration is extended on both the intake and exhaust lobes. This cam is ground from a new blank casting and is not a regrind. The H2 has the lobe ground for a mechanical fuel pump. Bolted-on drive gears raise the durability of the system and allow for added piece of mind with high powered engine combinations. Cam failuers and gear walk have been indicated in even stock Cummins engines using the P7100 pumps that used the press-on gear system. Bolt-on gears fix this potential trouble in high performance applications.

RPM range of the Helix 2 is from idle to 4000 RPM
Now Complete with Bolt, Billet Retainer, and Keyway!

Valve Spring Upgrades are recomended with the use of a Helix 2

Cams Here (http://tnt-power.com/Cams.html)

PM Sent

Mopar Man
07-11-2008, 11:29 AM
What is the labor time on the install? or roughly how much would it run dollar wise to install one?

kas83
07-11-2008, 03:03 PM
When are they going to be available again? Been sold out for awhile now.

Signature600
07-11-2008, 03:09 PM
I just got one a couple weeks ago...should be available still;)

Chris

PDW Power
07-11-2008, 03:10 PM
50 cams arrived and have all been spoken for by vendors in early June. You should check with each vendor to see availability. The vendors can be found at http://www.f1diesel.com/contacts. (http://www.f1diesel.com/contacts.html)html We are currently sold out of the cams but we are ready for the next shipment with a waiting list.

Bob Wagner
07-11-2008, 04:05 PM
I have a FEW helix 2's left :welcome:

Mopar Man
07-11-2008, 04:16 PM
I have a FEW helix 2's left :welcome:So what is the labor like to install one?

Big Swole
07-11-2008, 04:21 PM
So what is the labor like to install one?


:pop::pop::pop:

joefarmer
07-11-2008, 04:27 PM
So what is the labor like to install one?
If it's your first time plan on 8 hours out and 10 hours back in. A good shop should be able to do it within a day if it's not their first time- 10-12 hours tops.

RonA
07-11-2008, 04:27 PM
10 hours.

Big Swole
07-12-2008, 12:50 AM
If it's your first time plan on 8 hours out and 10 hours back in. A good shop should be able to do it within a day if it's not their first time- 10-12 hours tops.


Day-UM!!!! Is the cam mod really worth the $$$ ???

I gonna go twins sometime soon and spool is gonna be an issue.....That's just a LOT of Chedder for what seems like a little bit of spool, rpm, and power....

Or, is this cam mod even needed for a daily driven 700-750 truck?

Man, That's a big hit on the wallet!!

TwistedDiesel
07-12-2008, 01:35 AM
Ive got a new one im sell you for $420shipped plus your core

dzlfarmboy
07-12-2008, 06:26 AM
I have a FEW helix 2's left :welcome:
You been on vaction or something:poke:, Get a new telephone number?

joefarmer
07-12-2008, 11:05 PM
Day-UM!!!! Is the cam mod really worth the $$$ ???

I gonna go twins sometime soon and spool is gonna be an issue.....That's just a LOT of Chedder for what seems like a little bit of spool, rpm, and power....

Or, is this cam mod even needed for a daily driven 700-750 truck?

Man, That's a big hit on the wallet!!
They actually make 600hp more streetable with the wider RPM range. I think I posted the sheets before, but Chris & I dyno'd on the same dyno, same day and my torque curve was decently flat with the H2. His curve peaked early and went south after 2700rpm with the stock 12v cam. This behavior is more pronouced on the CR engines.

Big Swole
07-12-2008, 11:17 PM
They actually make 600hp more streetable with the wider RPM range. I think I posted the sheets before, but Chris & I dyno'd on the same dyno, same day and my torque curve was decently flat with the H2. His curve peaked early and went south after 2700rpm with the stock 12v cam. This behavior is more pronouced on the CR engines.

So your saying its worth it at ANY Hp range??

Wondering if I should save to have and H2 installed while my truck is down for the twins?? I guess the H2 would really help the twins....

joefarmer
07-12-2008, 11:51 PM
If they're bigger than stock, then I believe you'll like the cam to make them feel alive at the bottom and top ends. Here's the dyno sheet from my '98. I think it was a GT42 with a 71mm wheel as a single and about a 200hp shot. Very, very laggy and wouldn't spool until ~2300 on the street.

http://www.firepunk.com/albums/98misc/0428dyno.gif

Jim Fulmer
07-13-2008, 08:43 AM
Ive got a new one im sell you for $420shipped plus your core

What happened from 06' when he got $800 for his cams and 1G is it had a bolt on gear?

Jim

SINNER
07-13-2008, 10:39 AM
They just dropped in price. And all come with the bolt and retainer for no extra charge now. I don't think you can even get the press on gear version any longer. Under $500 depending on who you get it from.

kas83
07-13-2008, 10:45 AM
Under $500 depending on who you get it from.

Yep, if the vendor can get ahold of one. Or in you can actually get the vendor to talk to you. I think I know why one of the vendors still has a couple...

Bob Wagner
07-13-2008, 01:53 PM
you called?

Roy 31
08-10-2008, 09:15 PM
I know I called, Bob that is by e-mail 2 days ago to by a cam. No response!!!

Roy 31
08-26-2008, 09:34 PM
Whens Don going to release another batch?

killed300ex
09-12-2008, 10:28 AM
These still on backorder? Couple sites I have seen say they are and I am in need of one to get my motor back together since my cam gear has decided to start to walk off.

Roy 31
10-07-2008, 11:16 AM
Got mine this past saturday, thanks to Cory a PDW! Going in this week!

Bob Wagner
10-07-2008, 11:22 AM
cams and springs in stock.

Roy 31
10-07-2008, 11:28 AM
Cory at www.PDWpower.com has excellent customer service and went out of his way to take care of me!

Big Swole
11-12-2008, 05:51 PM
Helix 2 cam and Hamilton 110# springs??? issues with this???

Little birdie told me that brand New Tappets would need to be used......Any thoughts????

dzlfarmboy
11-12-2008, 05:56 PM
Time will tell, im waiting to see if any issue's arive from that combination.

Big Swole
11-12-2008, 06:07 PM
Time will tell, im waiting to see if any issue's arive from that combination.


Has anyone done this yet???

Feed back...Hello?? (knock knock)

Thanks!

triton
11-12-2008, 06:11 PM
unless it's an inferior cam which I'm sure it's not... I doubt there will be issue with that combo. I asked Hamilton the same thing and he agrees, there wouldn't be a problem.

It's the combo I have now and the truck is purring right along.

Big Swole
11-12-2008, 06:17 PM
unless it's an inferior cam which I'm sure it's not... I doubt there will be issue with that combo. I asked Hamilton the same thing and he agrees, there wouldn't be a problem.

It's the combo I have now and the truck is purring right along.


Great to here it's running....Pm details....If your not posting results


As far as the cam/spring combo, I'd probably still do New tappets just to make sure....

Anybody know what tappets cost from Cummins??

dzlfarmboy
11-12-2008, 08:07 PM
Great to here it's running....Pm details....If your not posting results


As far as the cam/spring combo, I'd probably still do New tappets just to make sure....

Anybody know what tappets cost from Cummins??


I know of a few running that combo, lifters arn't to much money but are fun changing them out. I would think your stock ones would be fine with fairly low miles on them.

Big Swole
11-12-2008, 08:24 PM
I know of a few running that combo, lifters arn't to much money but are fun changing them out. I would think your stock ones would be fine with fairly low miles on them.

Well, I've never done it but it will have to be done anyway (By Jeff Garmon of course)...My whole block has got to come out and to the machine shop...:doh:

Lets just say ..she's hospitalized right now and Surgery is Required....So new tappets will go in anyway just to be safe...

Bad-Duvall
11-12-2008, 08:26 PM
In my opinion the tappets MUST be chaged there is a wear pattern started with in 10 min of run time! I know they are pita to change but i know that even if i had a bran new motor from cummins that had only been ran for quality checks I would still change the tappets if I were to install a new cam! I know that there have been many people who havent and are fine. so they think! I have removed many CR after market cams and the ALL have issues with flaking and none of them had the tappets changed.

I know I went off track but there is a BIG issue with the cams in the 3rd gens maby its the Zink bein takin out of the oil maby its the hard ness of the cams what ever it is it needs to be fixed and corrected!

Big Swole
11-12-2008, 08:29 PM
In my opinion the tappets MUST be chaged there is a wear pattern started with in 10 min of run time! I know they are pita to change but i know that even if i had a bran new motor from cummins that had only been ran for quality checks I would still change the tappets!

It's settled then...New tappets are gonna go in.....Since the whole thing will be apart, I'd be stupid not too..

Btw, Is there anything else I should replace besides the cam, tappets, etc..?

Bad-Duvall
11-12-2008, 08:39 PM
It's settled then...New tappets are gonna go in.....Since the whole thing will be apart, I'd be stupid not too..

Btw, Is there anything else I should replace besides the cam, tappets, etc..?


I dont rember how much they are but they arnt to bad! But you had better plan on adding about 1 hole day to the install to exchange the tappets and just hope you dont drop one :bang caus theres no real good way get the oil pan off with out lifting the motor up or out of the truck.

triton
11-12-2008, 08:47 PM
Can we get an opinion from Don on this spring / cam mix question ?

new tappets with a new cam is all good but, Swoles original question was about the heavier springs with a Helix II

Camotanker
11-12-2008, 09:20 PM
I just got running a helix 2 with 50,000 miles on it over 2 years. In my opinion, I ran this truck pretty hard all the time and the cam came out better than I could have ever imagined. Since the motor is out, I'm sending the cam and tappets back to him for his inspection with a fine tooth comb.

Even thought the market has changed over the years, competition has increased, and demand has increased... Don has been a forefather of performance during a time when there wasn't many others out there doing much for the hobby/sport. I think the advice you are receiving is sound! If your going to do the cam, dedicate an entire day to be safe and change out the tappets.

Good luck brother with whatever cam you decide and hope you are happy with what you get. With a good cam, you will notice a difference in performance right away!

bh10
11-12-2008, 09:25 PM
It's settled then...New tappets are gonna go in.....Since the whole thing will be apart, I'd be stupid not too..

Btw, Is there anything else I should replace besides the cam, tappets, etc..?

How many miles do you have? IMO Id rather spend the money on pushrods then tappets.

And also when it comes to cams Id go w/ someone who will build a cam with your specs in mind

Bad-Duvall
11-12-2008, 09:34 PM
How many miles do you have? IMO Id rather spend the money on pushrods then tappets.

And also when it comes to cams Id go w/ someone who will build a cam with your specs in mind

Why?

bh10
11-12-2008, 09:37 PM
Why?

Why what?

Bad-Duvall
11-13-2008, 06:18 AM
Why what?

Why would you rather spend the money on push tubes then tappets? That makes no sence to me. What we are talking about is can wear and how to prevent it yes it is good practis to chage push tubes when changing tappets but not as critical as the tappets. I just want to get to the bottom on why the cams are failing in the common rail trucks? I might also add its not just one cam supplyer its all of them!!

Big Swole
11-13-2008, 06:52 AM
Well guys, thanks for the advice..

Like I said earlier...My Whole motor, block, etc has to come Out and Apart to go to the machine shop to get a make over....Had a boo boo!!
So new tappets will be ordered...I might even do push tubes....

I just want to do this ONCE and do it right!!!

It will be a Helix 2 cam going in....I've got the Ham. springs already....It would only make sense to have new tappets at least...

Thanks again guys....I'll keep you posted on the progress and results...

I can't stand my baby being hurt like this!!! LOL

dzlfarmboy
11-13-2008, 07:08 AM
Well guys, thanks for the advice..

Like I said earlier...My Whole motor, block, etc has to come Out and Apart to go to the machine shop to get a make over....Had a boo boo!!
So new tappets will be ordered...I might even do push tubes....

I just want to do this ONCE and do it right!!!

It will be a Helix 2 cam going in....I've got the Ham. springs already....It would only make sense to have new tappets at least...

Thanks again guys....I'll keep you posted on the progress and results...

I can't stand my baby being hurt like this!!! LOL

Yeah If your engine is out I would def put new tappets in, It would't be anymore work. What kind of boo boo did we have? An expensive one I see.

triton
11-13-2008, 07:10 AM
Why would you rather spend the money on push tubes then tappets? That makes no sence to me. What we are talking about is can wear and how to prevent it yes it is good practis to chage push tubes when changing tappets but not as critical as the tappets. I just want to get to the bottom on why the cams are failing in the common rail trucks? I might also add its not just one cam supplyer its all of them!!

I'd think if there were a bunch of cams failing... there'd be a lot more talk about it. I've not seen anyone... recently anyway claim their cam has failed. I've also not seen any aftermarket tappets that claim to be better than stock. You say there's wear after 10 miles so what's going to be different if they're changed ? In 10 miles they'll be worn again.

Since I've changed to 110lbs springs a billet tubes, I do expect more than normal wear but, see no reason to upgrade tappets although the one's I have are only a year old. Guess I'll find out once I pull the cam.

Bad-Duvall
11-13-2008, 07:13 AM
By you takin the motor out you just saved your self lots-o-headach. lets just say you must be very very skilled to get the tappets back in.

Bad-Duvall
11-13-2008, 07:30 AM
I'd think if there were a bunch of cams failing... there'd be a lot more talk about it. I've not seen anyone... recently anyway claim their cam has failed. I've also not seen any aftermarket tappets that claim to be better than stock. You say there's wear after 10 miles so what's going to be different if they're changed ? In 10 miles they'll be worn again.

Since I've changed to 110lbs springs a billet tubes, I do expect more than normal wear but, see no reason to upgrade tappets although the one's I have are only a year old. Guess I'll find out once I pull the cam.


I dont mean that there are up-graded tappets the the stock tappets are fine. but said cam and said tappets are unique like finger prints and once they have ran together they will always have that patten in them. so what i mean with that is they are pairs like a bering and race you cant just change one.

Like i said i have pulled several after market cams they all look similar the nose of the cam pitting/flaking. there is a cause maby its hardness maby its the lack of zink.

Also in the last 2 years how many cams do you know of that have been installed ran 10,000+ mi then removed?

dzlfarmboy
11-13-2008, 07:38 AM
By you takin the motor out you just saved your self lots-o-headach. lets just say you must be very very skilled to get the tappets back in.

Yeah their tedious, A little 8mm Snap On bore scope camera comes in real handy to see down the push tube hole. That and having the engine parallel to the floor helps the plumb bob plug go in the hole a lil easier.

Big Swole
11-13-2008, 07:54 AM
I can def. see the point of having 2 brand new serfaces mating to each other during break in...That makes perfect since for those two to run together from the start...

I melted a piston ( #4) and the block is a little screwed too....Jeff looked at it when I got it all down.....I had to leave Tues. night to be on duty Wed and today...Going back down Friday, but I think Jeff was going to go ahead and get the block all the way out and start tarring it down to send to the machine shop....Ugh!!


So, with the block already out, Is it still hard to remove / replace the tappets????

Is there any REAL reason (performance or reliability wise) that I should change the push rods??? Don't need to spend anymore than nessessary for Obvious reasons!!!!!

Thanks!!

dzlfarmboy
11-13-2008, 08:38 AM
No there will be no more labor involved installing new tappets, you have to remove the old ones if taking the block to a machine shop. With the Hamiltons Springs stiffer pushrods might be needed. But the Sportsman springs dont cause and push rod deflection.

Man those CR's are hell on pistons.

Bad-Duvall
11-13-2008, 08:50 AM
the only reasone i see is if you go back with a re-grind cam then you may need .100 longer push tubes.

Big Swole
11-13-2008, 08:54 AM
the only reasone i see is if you go back with a re-grind cam then you may need .100 longer push tubes.


The Helix 2 is done from a blank, Right???

Not gonna do a regrind....

Bad-Duvall
11-13-2008, 08:57 AM
Right!

Soup Nazi
11-13-2008, 09:56 AM
A couple if things that have happend over the summer has changed our ideas and policy on "drop-in" cams. Meaning installing a Helix 2 cam without changing the tappets.

In the early days we had either stock, Enterprise Engine, or Pro/Sportman Springs. All 3 of these springs have been very successful with our program of installing the Helix cams and using your old tappets. Saving time and energy on a cam install. Simplification was the idea.

Higher spring pressures (as of late) with a new cam and used tappets is starting to take its toll. The failures are still considered rare, but we have replaced 5 cams this past 6 months. In all the years since 2004, we have had no returns for worn lobes.

This is a direct result of higher spring pressures and todays oils having less of the good things we need to cut wear down for environmental concerns.

We now require that new tappets be installed if you are going to run high spring pressures. If you use stock, Enterprise Engine, or Pro/sportsman springs you can skip the new tappets and continue as always.

Big Swole
11-13-2008, 10:03 AM
A couple if things that have happend over the summer has changed our ideas and policy on "drop-in" cams. Meaning installing a Helix 2 cam without changing the tappets.

In the early days we had either stock, Enterprise Engine, or Pro/Sportman Springs. All 3 of these springs have been very successful with our program of installing the Helix cams and using your old tappets. Saving time and energy on a cam install. Simplification was the idea.

Higher spring pressures (as of late) with a new cam and used tappets is starting to take its toll. The failures are still considered rare, but we have replaced 5 cams this past 6 months. In all the years since 2004, we have had no returns for worn lobes.

This is a direct result of higher spring pressures and todays oils having less of the good things we need to cut wear down for environmental concerns.

We now require that new tappets be installed if you are going to run high spring pressures. If you use stock, Enterprise Engine, or Pro/sportsman springs you can skip the new tappets and continue as always.

Thank you Don for clarification on this!! :Cheer:

I can't wait to get your cam in there and the biggers injectors!! :rockwoot:

I've seen some really big numbers from people using the combo with the air I'll have......Thanks again!!

triton
11-13-2008, 10:18 AM
A couple if things that have happend over the summer has changed our ideas and policy on "drop-in" cams. Meaning installing a Helix 2 cam without changing the tappets.

In the early days we had either stock, Enterprise Engine, or Pro/Sportman Springs. All 3 of these springs have been very successful with our program of installing the Helix cams and using your old tappets. Saving time and energy on a cam install. Simplification was the idea.

Higher spring pressures (as of late) with a new cam and used tappets is starting to take its toll. The failures are still considered rare, but we have replaced 5 cams this past 6 months. In all the years since 2004, we have had no returns for worn lobes.

This is a direct result of higher spring pressures and todays oils having less of the good things we need to cut wear down for environmental concerns.

We now require that new tappets be installed if you are going to run high spring pressures. If you use stock, Enterprise Engine, or Pro/sportsman springs you can skip the new tappets and continue as always.

Thanks for clarifying. If you could answer one more question plz. Since my lifters have been mated with your cam for over a year now, ( that sounded :homo: LOL ) they're obviously matched as far as wear. Since I now have the 110lbs springs, how do you think that will effect their wear on the cam / lifters ?

also what metals would show high in a oil analysis if the cam were wearing ?

Big Swole
11-13-2008, 10:30 AM
Since my lifters have been mated with your cam for over a year now, ( that sounded :homo: LOL )



LMAO!! :hehe:

That did sound a little Sweet Ty!!!! lol

DrSpeed
11-13-2008, 10:52 AM
I just got running a helix 2 with 50,000 miles on it over 2 years. In my opinion, I ran this truck pretty hard all the time and the cam came out better than I could have ever imagined. Since the motor is out, I'm sending the cam and tappets back to him for his inspection with a fine tooth comb.



SPONSORED BABY! Hook me up!

Soup Nazi
11-13-2008, 12:53 PM
Thanks for clarifying. If you could answer one more question plz. Since my lifters have been mated with your cam for over a year now, ( that sounded :homo: LOL ) they're obviously matched as far as wear. Since I now have the 110lbs springs, how do you think that will effect their wear on the cam / lifters ?

also what metals would show high in a oil analysis if the cam were wearing ?

I think that new tappets with a new cam and everything will be fine in your case.

Oil additives containing moly, phos, and zinc ar a great idea for cam wear.

Diesel Freak
11-13-2008, 12:59 PM
A couple if things that have happend over the summer has changed our ideas and policy on "drop-in" cams. Meaning installing a Helix 2 cam without changing the tappets.

In the early days we had either stock, Enterprise Engine, or Pro/Sportman Springs. All 3 of these springs have been very successful with our program of installing the Helix cams and using your old tappets. Saving time and energy on a cam install. Simplification was the idea.

Higher spring pressures (as of late) with a new cam and used tappets is starting to take its toll. The failures are still considered rare, but we have replaced 5 cams this past 6 months. In all the years since 2004, we have had no returns for worn lobes.

This is a direct result of higher spring pressures and todays oils having less of the good things we need to cut wear down for environmental concerns.

We now require that new tappets be installed if you are going to run high spring pressures. If you use stock, Enterprise Engine, or Pro/sportsman springs you can skip the new tappets and continue as always.

Thank goodness for Magnetic Drain Plugs!!!!

triton
11-13-2008, 01:49 PM
I think that new tappets with a new cam and everything will be fine in your case.

Oil additives containing moly, phos, and zinc ar a great idea for cam wear.

Thanks :Cheer: