The 06' Difference?

[Burner]

What's so different about the 06' Dodge compared to the 05, 04 & 03? :confused:

[Wyatt Earp]

I think (but not sure) that it is a hybrid between the fully environmental '07 and the powered 610 version. Not sure I'd touch one though. I'd let the dust settle on this stuff first. If I was buying a used 3rd gen I'd lean towards an early '05. The '03's had something like 47 different software versions and a mix and match set of parts from the second gen's through. I see the same happening with the first '07's as well. Give it at least 1 full model year to get the software and the motor sorted out. JMHO...

[Burner]

I'm guessing the softwear break must be on 6/6 of this year? I remember something about the SMARTY not working with build dates past that point. I wonder if a re-flash would flip ya past that point?


I was curious as to the physical changes. I can see the computer is angled and that the turbo seems to have a large amount of meat behind it...but what of the valves and stuff you can't really see?:confused:

[24VChevy]

I have a 06/06 and the truck is basically the same as a 05. The big differance is in the ECM. They added programming to allow an exhaust brake. I just added a ground signal to the ecm to enable the exhuast brake and it puts the trans into a tow haul mode that accually down shifts the trans from OD to 3rd. The ECM burps the throttle during the down shift to ease the strain on the drivetrain. There are other small changes but none that are signifigant.

Malcolm

[K5KRAZIE]

I have a 06/06 and the truck is basically the same as a 05. The big differance is in the ECM. They added programming to allow an exhaust brake. I just added a ground signal to the ecm to enable the exhuast brake and it puts the trans into a tow haul mode that accually down shifts the trans from OD to 3rd. The ECM burps the throttle during the down shift to ease the strain on the drivetrain. There are other small changes but none that are signifigant.

Malcolm
Just bought an '06 built just short of the June cut off. The MAJOR issue is the pressure in the rail. My understanding is they lowered rail pressures to avoid cracking injectors from '06.5 on, among other ECM changes. The '07s are the nono so far. I just wanted to get in before there were no more '06s left.:ylsuper: Internally I'm going to say the motors are the same.....

[Burner]

So, we have weak injectors? .....that doesn't make any damm sense.

[K5KRAZIE]

So, we have weak injectors? .....that doesn't make any damm sense.
The '06.5 rail pressures are less than the '06 and older, to avoid cracking.
Get it?

[Burner]

We need rail psi to keep the events clean. Lower the rail and you Slow Down, Loose HP and Loose MPG.....not good.

[Wyatt Earp]

Lowering the rail pressure shouldn't do anything except increase the life of your CP3 and your injectors themselves. Yes, you would loose HP but...

Increasing rail pressures, increases the likelihood of premature failures in the injection system.

[K5KRAZIE]

We need rail psi to keep the events clean. Lower the rail and you Slow Down, Loose HP and Loose MPG.....not good.
Which is why you want an '06 and not an '06.5.......

[Burner]

Lowering the rail pressure shouldn't do anything except increase the life of your CP3 and your injectors themselves. Yes, you would loose HP but...

Increasing rail pressures, increases the likelihood of premature failures in the injection system.

I agree, lower the HP on almost any engine and you will extend it's life ...or it should. However, how is it possible to lower the rail and still attain the current HP & TQ levels? Also, why would Dodge want to lower the PSI while the others are increasing it? Sounds to me like Dodge skimped out somewhere along the lines. (no pun intended) Maybe this is their idea of raising MPG or something? I know the fellas that tow in OEM dress will be mighty upset.

[Wyatt Earp]

I'm of the understanding that the GMC DMAX has the lowest rail pressure and hence the reason why few CP3 failures and rail problems. Maybe I'm wrong but this is how it was presented to me.

Also need to consider that the I6 has the most available (usable) Torque where the others have high HP etc. If you are a RV'er you'll want the low end vs. the highend.

I only know of one guy that has successfully hacked the system and removed injection events and lowered the rail pressure. He has no warranty and doesn't really care but has a good truck. I'm no where near that good with computers.

[Burner]

You know....I didn't think about it that way? If you lower the fuel all ya haft'a do is release more off the TQ management system. The Cummins is cut wayyyyyy back under 2000 RPM. However, between 1,700 and 2,300 RPM is where you need fuel while pulling. I don't see how cutting back fuel could save you time? Would it not just slow the truck down? If you slow down it drops a gear (3rd) and you could burn MORE fuel than you would with high rail pressure and low RPM (4th)....right? And yes, I'd like to be much better with computers as well.

[Burner]

Remember the Diesel Power "contest".. I wonder how the Dmax fellas attained higher MPG with their trucks? I belive Nick won. He had to have the best of both worlds, hp & fuel economy, to win the event. How did he do that with a 4x4?

[Wyatt Earp]

I dunno. Hence why I have a '02 VP44.

[MKoth]

If the rail pressure is lowered, then the HP is gained through timing and duration, which is the proper, and safe way, to add power.

[Burner]

So my 06 Dodge has the same valves as on 03' truck?

[ogrer]

Is it true then an '06 purchased in November '05 is the same as an 05' then?

Bob

[Wyatt Earp]

Very likely but not 100% certain.

[Bob Wagner]

I'm guessing the softwear break must be on 6/6 of this year? I remember something about the SMARTY not working with build dates past that point. I wonder if a re-flash would flip ya past that point?


I was curious as to the physical changes. I can see the computer is angled and that the turbo seems to have a large amount of meat behind it...but what of the valves and stuff you can't really see?:confused:


The smarty works on ALL 06's the 06/06 has nothing to do with smarty.

Thanks

[Burner]

Thanks Bob!

[super diesel]

How interesting. Lower pressure=less atomization=less compleatly burned fuel=more fuel to do same job=less fuel milage. Advanced timing and extended duration=more EGT=more fuel in before and after piston at optimum location (crank angle degrees)=possible washing of walls with diesel fuel spray, star patterns on top of pistons where the fuel makes no power=possible predetonation=compression of predetonation=extreme peak cylinder pressures. The latter part can be more of a factor with aftermarket programing control. Wonder what Dodges thinking is if they really do lower the pressures? Pressures between the CR cummins and the dmax use to be the same. Now the LBZ uses higher pressures. Doug and Nick in the Diesel Power Challenge were both only around 500hp on #2 at the time on stock injects and turbos. Just an observation and some questions.

[Burner]

maybe they are making larger holes in the injectors to cut down on the duration field? Then again..........

[super diesel]

Larger holes=less atomization=......... I'm interested to hear for sure if they realy are lowering the rail pressure. Back ward move? Hope not.

[Burner]

Larger holes=less atomization=......... I'm interested to hear for sure if they realy are lowering the rail pressure. Back ward move? Hope not.

true, large holes = less atomization.

I wonder if this fuel burns better @ Idle? I wonder if it burns faster?

[Burner]

Are the springs on an 06' any different? I thought they had more load #?

[24VChevy]

I hooked a Edge EZ to a early 06 and the truck had a rattle to it that was bad. The rail pressure relief valve was buringing hot in about 30 seconds. I had to take the Edge off and just run the Juice/attitude. I was hoping to stack both. On my truck build date 06/06 if the rail pressure is lower then I should be able to install the EZ. As I understand the Cummins increase the rail pressure a couple of times from 03-04 to 04-05 to 06. Then now they dropped the rail in 06/06? I will try a EZ tomorrow and see what the rail pressure runs and see if the injectors rattle. Any one know the relationship between rail pressure sensor voltage and PSI?

Thanks

Malcolm

[Wyatt Earp]

You probably already know this but from what I remember the rail pressure is in excess of 20,000 psi (24,500 to 27,000) and the voltage is a simple on / off (3V) max. I'm not 100% possitive though.

[24VChevy]

Your right about the high pressure but I think that the fuel pressure regulated from idle to WOT. At idle the pressure could be 5000 psi and at WOT it could be 27,000 psi. The rail pressure sensor voltage would follow this pressure curve.

[Burner]

Dang, I thought idle was sit'n around 12 or so?

[24VChevy]

I have not measured the pressures I was specualting what they could be.
Got to get me a gauge to measure up to 30,000 psi.

Malcolm

[Burner]

Please let us know you're findings.

[super diesel]

The rail is around 4900-5100 at idle and varies up to 23,000 psi at higher throttle settings. The voltage to the reg varies depending on fuel amount required to keep the rail pressure at what is being comanded from the computer. It is a control system that uses milamps to control the reg that inturn controls the pressure to the pump and in the rails. It reads the pressure info from the sensor on the rail and tell the computer what it needs. I've only been working hands on with the system for a few years now.

Malcolm, you will need a pressure transducer with a digital display that recalls for use, or you can splice in another pig tail to the sensor on the rail and convert the volts being read into pressure. The stock sensor is limited on how high it will read however.

[Burner]

How high will it read? And, can you replace it with something that will read 40k?

[24VChevy]

I haved looked at a few transducers on the market fairly pricy. I know there was someone offering a rail pressure gauge that would work off of the stock sensor. If anyone has the voltage/pressure info that would be great. The Dodge service manual does not seem to have that kind of info.

Thanks

Malcolm

[06-cummins]

i have a 12 05 truck 06 acording to dodge...i believe the inject them selves are dif they have some multi spray function they can change spay patterens or somthin like that....as for mpg its great on the high way in stock set 18-19 in 1 or 2 20-22....in town 17-18 if u stay out of the gas... i have a 6speed...so that helps....i have the edge with hot mode....cant make a full pull i hot it just spikes egts....besides that i love it ive pulled 13000 pounds up medium grade a 60 no prob....

[Wyatt Earp]

The only bit I found on the internet was that the Voltage of that little gizmo was from 0.5 to 4.5V (a peak voltage of 5V). It seems to state that the higher the voltage goes the lower the rail pressure is. Now, maybe that doesn't apply to the Dodge CTD but this was for a Cummins motor. I'll see if I can dig more up somewhere.

Rail pressures go from 3,000 at idle to 27,000 max but safe operating pressure is set to somewhere around 24,500.

[Burner]

It would be nice to have a 34k system like those on the Audi's.........

[super diesel]

27,000 max? Are you absolutly positive?

[Wyatt Earp]

Based on my internet research I'm confident that this is the limit. However, I haven't seen any first hand numbers.