4 link with air bags

[wrongway]

I got a catalog in the mail the other day from Air Ride Technology. I was thumbing through the page's, and they have a killer looking 4 link with air bags. How do you think that work on my 97 Dodge?? Look's so good, I may just buy one to look at. Seriously, what's ya'll's thought's about em. Just wondering. Gary

[wrongway]

Here's a link. www.ridetech.com
Go check em out, Gary

[Timbeaux]

This going on your race truck Gary?

[wrongway]

This going on your race truck Gary?

Yes it is, Timmy. Whatcha think???:evil :evil :evil

[joefarmer]

I would feel more comfortable with a Kelderman 4-link. The airlift seemed cheap & flimsy when HorsepowerTV put one on a few years ago.

brnadon.

[UNBROKEN]

I drool over this car at least once a week:
http://www.ridetech.com/projectview.asp?ID=12445&SUBSYS=CC#

There's my dream project.....diesel powered of course.

Sorry for the hijack Gary. LOL
I saw your link to them and had to drag it out.

[Timbeaux]

How prevalent are air ride setups in drag racing? I thought most folks were still using coilover setups?

[wrongway]

Tim, I really don't think anyone is using them. That's what makes them attractive to me. I really think they would work, and if the air bag's can't stand the pressure they can be easily swapped for coil-over's. Just thinkin outside the box. :kick:

[24VChevy]

I don't think that they will let you on the race track with an air bag the only supporting spring on the truck. I don't know the exact rules but on race I was at they would not let a truck down the truck with just the air bags on it.

Malcolm

[gunracer1]

all the kits i looked into were way to weak for my taste. i will build my own when i get the time. i really want to do the air ride on my 98 shorty.

[UNBROKEN]

Bagged trucks run in Houston on the NHRA sanctioned track all the time. Maybe it just depends on who's doing the teching that night.

[Crawler]

It will work but I would make two suggestions.

1 coil-overs work much better.
2 if you're planning on putting down big numbers, be sure to weld the brackets to the rear end. Don't rely on clamping using the bolt on kit. I've seen rear ends rotate inside the brackets.

By the way here is a pic that shows how I did my 4 link.

SMDiesel's "LIL 6BT"

~Wes~

[gunracer1]

hey wes i am old and fat, i want that nice smooth ride on air for my truck.

[Crawler]

Well "old fart" I'm more concerned about smooth ride on the highway and more concerned about traction on the track. ;)

My four link was set-up so that I can bolt in a set of Air Ride Technologies "Shockwaves" and have air ride.

Mike I think you and I had that discussion one before.

:poke:

~Wes~

[joefarmer]

Wes, that looks INSANE!!! I'm jealous!

brandon.

[AsTroSS]

Hey Crawler., nice 4 link :rockwoot:

What size heim joints (rod ends) do you used in your rear 4 link setup?

And please excplain to me, if americans talk about 3/4 heim joint , is 3/4 size of bearing hole or size of threaded end?

[joefarmer]

AFAIK, they are both 3/4 hole and 3/4 threaded rod. Check QA1's site for more specs:
http://www.carrerashocks.com/qa1_ms2005_rodends.pdf

bnraodn.

[Crawler]

The rod ends (heims) are 3/4" 4130 Chrome Moly.

Brandon, don't be jealous. At least yours is making passes right now. I haven't had time to finish putting mine together.

Right now I have the front suspension back off. I had the suspension done and then changed my mind. We're building new upper and lower control arms from scratch and going to coil-overs up front as well.

This truck sits obscenely low. We had to build a new tranny crossmember because the stock one was so low that you couldn't roll a coke can under it.

Truck has carpet, ac, heat, stereo (not just stock either), 2 corbeau FX2 buckets with 5 points, 14 point chrome moly cage (through the dash). Making a fiberglass dash for it now. I was going to use the stock dash, but it has a huge crack in it and I just cant see spending money to put a stock one back in. Using a removable Grant wheel and Autometer guages (200mph speedo, 6000 rpm tach, oil, fuel (level and pressure both), water, boost, drive pressure, volts, transmission, 2000 degree pyro all for the street driving. Plus a full RPM brand Data Logger for the track and the "home test track".

Painless wiring swithbox/wiring for all vitals (engine,fuel pumps, fan, water pump, nitrous, water/meth, guages). Factory wiring for the accesories and turn signals.

Sorry wasn't try to run away with this. I just ot to typing and didn't stop. :)

~Wes~

[Billysgoat]

Wes, that is one slick ride you have there bud :rockwoot:

[Crawler]

Thank You. Hopefully I can bring it out this year. I have two seats and two harnesses. So, anybody who's not too freaked out is welcome to go for a pass or two down the road. :evil

Then if you're still with me we'll make a bozai pass *nx* .

~Wes~

[joefarmer]

:drool1: Mine's broken right now. They think a little too much nitrous on the line had something to do with shearing transmission shafts. :evil Does anyone run a trans brake in the lighter trucks? I know the heavy trucks make transmissions explode, but what about these lighter, 4-linked versions?

bnraodn.

[Crawler]

I looked at doing a transbrake. But, all of the tranny guys didn't want to touch it.

Even with my truck lightned they all thought that with the power I plan on making, the hit of the nitrous, and traction that my shafts wouldn't like me not to mention that they were afraid I might end up wearing some of my tranny case home in my shins.

I played with one but I ended up taking it out. For me I went with wilwood 4 piston calipers in the rear with some special modofications to my brake system (think fluid routing). That way I can load my suspension, absorb some of the tire shock, and leave with the converter at full stall without pushing through the lights.

~Wes~

[K5KRAZIE]

It will work but I would make two suggestions.

1 coil-overs work much better.
2 if you're planning on putting down big numbers, be sure to weld the brackets to the rear end. Don't rely on clamping using the bolt on kit. I've seen rear ends rotate inside the brackets.

By the way here is a pic that shows how I did my 4 link.

SMDiesel's "LIL 6BT"

~Wes~
IYO why do coil overs work much better?

[Patrick@DPP]

I cant find any pictures right now, but we use air bags on our pulling truck. Its a 1000 hp Ford gasser, but we pull in a class that required 1 inch of rear suspension travel. To eliminate weight from the rear of the truck, and transfer it to the front bumper, we removed the rear leaf springs. We built our selves a 4 link rear suspension. The top to links came from the center of the pumpkin going outwards to the frame, and the bottom two links are the opposite. These two opposite "V's" is what kept our rearend centered under the truck. Then we mounted two Airbags from Airlift (just one of those overload kits), and put our stop blocks in place using 1" all thread for our adjustment. We only had to use about 8 pounds of air to keep the truck at the 1 inch ride hight rule. Once you hooked up and pulled the slack out of the chain you were on solid suspension. I know its a totally differant application, but I thought I would share. lol It takes some abuse also.

Patrick

[Crawler]

The coilovers allow more adjustment believe it or not. With air bags to get a compression rate difference you must in flate or deflate the airbag, this in turn changes ride height. With a coil-over you have the option to change height and compression as well as rate independent of each other.

Now, in this comparison I'm speaking of conventional air-bag setups.

But, if you were to use limiting straps and stops, then some of that could be thrown out the window.

But with a coilover the you also still have options for different spring rates (1 rate, 2 rate, progressive/variable). With your air bag you will still be limited by the properties of air and its ability to be compressed.

Air-bags could be viable. I hope that if you chose to use them that it comes out without a glitch. On the other hand they could be a tuning nightmare, due to the extra fabrication and equipment required to accomodate certain changes.

In my application. I need a coil-over due to space constraints.

I wouldn't want to use a "Shockwave" for hardcore racing. So I would have to have the airbag and the shocks mounted separately. This would be a bit problematic for me.

For street driving and a little bit of play, I might run the "Shockwaves" but on ly then. I don't feel they would hold up very well to the abuse that my suspension must contend with. They're a bit pricey to replace on a regular basis.

I'm sure that I've forgatten something But, if I did; I imagine it will be mentioned. ;)

~Wes~

[Trapper]

I cant find any pictures right now, but we use air bags on our pulling truck. Its a 1000 hp Ford gasser, but we pull in a class that required 1 inch of rear suspension travel. To eliminate weight from the rear of the truck, and transfer it to the front bumper, we removed the rear leaf springs. We built our selves a 4 link rear suspension. The top to links came from the center of the pumpkin going outwards to the frame, and the bottom two links are the opposite. These two opposite "V's" is what kept our rearend centered under the truck. Then we mounted two Airbags from Airlift (just one of those overload kits), and put our stop blocks in place using 1" all thread for our adjustment. We only had to use about 8 pounds of air to keep the truck at the 1 inch ride hight rule. Once you hooked up and pulled the slack out of the chain you were on solid suspension. I know its a totally differant application, but I thought I would share. lol It takes some abuse also.

Patrick

Patrick any pics of that 4 link?

[Patrick@DPP]

It was saved on our old server. Since we moved our store to a new server, I think they are Pigs in space. I will go dig around and see if I can find anything.

[Patrick@DPP]

We own Truckpulls.com, DiscountPowerParts.com, Powerstroke-diesel.com, and I cant find those pictures anywhere. I thought they were on truckpulls, but they must have been deleted when we moved to the new server in september. When I get to the shop tomorrow I will see if they are on one of the computers, or a disk. That truck is baried in the lower garages for the next few months, so it would be awhile before I could take new pictures. For truckpulling it worked great. Just enough preasure to hold the truck up off of the blocks to meet rule requirements. This year they actually changed the rule to solid suspension (finally). We are not pulling this year.

I will check for sure tomorrow.

Patrick

[K5KRAZIE]

The coilovers allow more adjustment believe it or not. With air bags to get a compression rate difference you must in flate or deflate the airbag, this in turn changes ride height. With a coil-over you have the option to change height and compression as well as rate independent of each other.

Now, in this comparison I'm speaking of conventional air-bag setups.

But, if you were to use limiting straps and stops, then some of that could be thrown out the window.

But with a coilover the you also still have options for different spring rates (1 rate, 2 rate, progressive/variable). With your air bag you will still be limited by the properties of air and its ability to be compressed.

Air-bags could be viable. I hope that if you chose to use them that it comes out without a glitch. On the other hand they could be a tuning nightmare, due to the extra fabrication and equipment required to accomodate certain changes.

In my application. I need a coil-over due to space constraints.

I wouldn't want to use a "Shockwave" for hardcore racing. So I would have to have the airbag and the shocks mounted separately. This would be a bit problematic for me.

For street driving and a little bit of play, I might run the "Shockwaves" but on ly then. I don't feel they would hold up very well to the abuse that my suspension must contend with. They're a bit pricey to replace on a regular basis.

I'm sure that I've forgatten something But, if I did; I imagine it will be mentioned. ;)

~Wes~
:thankyou2:

This makes some sence to me, I do agree that the "bags" will require some more time to figure. I'm thinking that the change in spring rate would be easier as all you would do is add or subtract air and your spring rate would change. As with most "race" setups the travel is really just a side effect of the design, down travel is very limited and up travel is what you make it.....
Interesting to say the least.:Cheer:

[hotpursuit]

i too would say go coilover... there adjustability is almost endless... if you subtract air you also subtract ride hieght.... air is an uncontroled progessive spring action... coilovers you can run dual or even triple rate and have each spring come into play by adjusting the collar...

also watch how you set up your 4 link... if you build it with too much anti-squat... you can get tons of wheel hop... to little and not enough bite... make your link mounts on the frame adjustable to better tune you bite (anti-squat)

[Trapper]

That Kelderman kit that they put on 4x4extream this weekend on a 08 Ford looked nice, but it was a bolt on.

[NPloysa]

I'm bagging my '06 Dodge. Not for drag racing (though I may) but for ride and well, because it's a fun project. I am doing fronts only for now, and they are 90% done. I am also replacing my control arms with DOM and joints.

The rears are a bolt on, similar to Keldermans, and I am running the control arms to the front spring perch in a bracket.

The lift overall is 2" in the rear, 3" in the front, since the front is a touch lower, an inch actually (3"-2"= 1" haha). The lift is not enough to go any further to the center of the truck with brackets but I can if I decided to lift it any more in the future, after fabbing up new brackets.

So, here are some pics if anyone is interested, these are a few months old so if you want more recent you can PM me or email me uapilot1@hotmail.com

http://rides.webshots.com/album/273578843mGEMyY?vhost=rides

Nick

[TJSHOTROD]

That Kelderman kit that they put on 4x4extream this weekend on a 08 Ford looked nice, but it was a bolt on.

Those Kelderman kit might work but the look like pure crap. The brackets are huge and ugly and the links look terrible. I understand the made it to be bolt on but it looks horrible.

TJ