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-   -   Oil Cooler Failure? (http://www.competitiondiesel.com/forums/showthread.php?t=198998)

CorneliusRox 01-16-2018 11:33 AM

Oil Cooler Failure?
 
My buddy's truck started knocking really bad on the way home from a sled trip, luckily we were only ~50miles from home. Tons of white, unburnt fuel coming out of the exhaust.
We checked fluid and it looked normal (level, color, not milky), started it back up at idle and it sounded and felt awful. It was dumping fuel out the exhaust still.

2013, 130,000 miles, deleted, tuned, otherwise stock. Meticulously maintained.

He bought the extended warranty so he had it towed to the dealership. I thought it felt like an injector tip let go or maybe the needle got stuck in the full open position?
The dealership said it's an oil cooler, but I've never heard of one going, and I feel like we would have seen the oil all milky. That would also mean the knock would have been from a rob bearing which would need that oil milky for a little while. They said it needs a while rebuild and quoted it at $30k if FCA doesn't warranty it (because of it being deleted)...

Anyways, looking for thoughts on it. Is the oil cooler a common failure for 6.7's? Are the injector tips? or maybe a cracked piston?

And we might be looking for a used 6.7L longblock if anyone has one lying around. :lolly:

jimbo486 01-16-2018 12:17 PM

I have a hard time buying that it's the oil cooler. But, if they wanna take a stab at it and the warranty covers it, let 'em.

Signature600 01-16-2018 12:24 PM

$30K.... :hehe: :hehe: :hehe:

Not an oil cooler failure, that would put oil in the radiator. That's a fuel problem

Chris

Mark Nixon 01-16-2018 12:25 PM

Sounds like the dealership is lost in space, as usual.
Don't count on them doing the install, because it's deleted, in fact they may try to hang him with all new DPF components to do the job.

It sounds likely that it locked a pintle, or blew the tip off an injector and burned the cylinder/piston to me.
If he has to pay, demand the core back, it'll tell the whole story.

I have several 13+ longblocks, that I could be convinced to sell, that need externals from light fire damage.
Which he will have.

Mark.

CorneliusRox 01-16-2018 03:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jimbo486 (Post 2652262)
I have a hard time buying that it's the oil cooler. But, if they wanna take a stab at it and the warranty covers it, let 'em.

Yeah, me too. And they called him and said it isn't going to be covered because it's deleted. To me, if they're claiming it's the oil cooler, that shouldn't really see any extra damage from a tune/delete!

Quote:

Originally Posted by Signature600 (Post 2652263)
$30K.... :hehe: :hehe: :hehe:

Not an oil cooler failure, that would put oil in the radiator. That's a fuel problem

Chris

100% agree. I don't think they know what they're doing.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mark Nixon (Post 2652266)
Sounds like the dealership is lost in space, as usual.
Don't count on them doing the install, because it's deleted, in fact they may try to hang him with all new DPF components to do the job.

It sounds likely that it locked a pintle, or blew the tip off an injector and burned the cylinder/piston to me.
If he has to pay, demand the core back, it'll tell the whole story.

I have several 13+ longblocks, that I could be convinced to sell, that need externals from light fire damage.
Which he will have.

Mark.

Yeah, way out in space land.
I agree. I don't know enough about CR injectors, but it sure sounds like a tip blew off and probably ate everything in its path.
I'll be helping him tear the head off and we'll find the whole story. I'll post pictures assuming I remember to take them.

Mark, PM me a price and the next time you think you'll be somewhat close so we could meet and pick it up.

Be forewarned he's in denial right now and thinks he's going to be able to get by with replacing one injector... :doh: ha ha

Mark Nixon 01-16-2018 04:40 PM

It's not out of the realm of possibility that it simply dropped a valve, killing the injector in the process.
I've had a couple 13+ in here that did just that, no rhyme or reason.

If it just locked the pintle open, you might get very lucky and it didn't do any damage, but 50 miles is like an eternity on a wounded engine.

Mark.

Snedge 01-16-2018 04:52 PM

I'm laughing.

f6jbob 01-16-2018 05:19 PM

When the head comes off take notice of piston protrusion on all cylinders. Very possible to shorten a rod.$.02

CorneliusRox 01-16-2018 07:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mark Nixon (Post 2652322)
It's not out of the realm of possibility that it simply dropped a valve, killing the injector in the process.
I've had a couple 13+ in here that did just that, no rhyme or reason.

If it just locked the pintle open, you might get very lucky and it didn't do any damage, but 50 miles is like an eternity on a wounded engine.

Mark.

Yeah, we had that happen on an 03 before. Cut the piston up like a hot knife to butter, beat the head up a bit, and after we got the block clean, realized it had a nice crack down it that the naked eye couldn't see...
What's the cause for that typically? Excessive heat? Bad part?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Snedge (Post 2652324)
I'm laughing.

Read the update and I think you'll laugh harder ;-)

Quote:

Originally Posted by f6jbob (Post 2652328)
When the head comes off take notice of piston protrusion on all cylinders. Very possible to shorten a rod.$.02

I definitely wouldn't have thought of that. Good call!

CorneliusRox 01-16-2018 07:57 PM

So my buddy picked up the truck after work. Turns out the dealer decided to "try and start the truck up after it'd been sitting for a while."
https://farm5.staticflickr.com/4603/...60765137_z.jpg
https://farm5.staticflickr.com/4714/...57364df2_z.jpg

Here's what they claimed:
- They had the injectors out and tested them and that wasn't the case (but the valve cover bolts are still dirty like no wrench has ever touched them).
- The engine was junk when it rolled in, so putting a hole in the block doesn't really matter.

My thoughts are, it was an injector, it filled a cylinder with fuel, they tried cranking on it, bent and then broke a rod, and then sent it through the wall.

Oh, and that oil sure doesn't look milky to me! When my buddy questioned that, the 'diesel tech' told him, "Diesel oil is different, it mixes well with coolant."

If nothing else, I feel like he's got some good ammo to talk to FCA about it and maybe they'll take care of him.

jasonc 01-16-2018 08:04 PM

Deleted truck, dream on. Ain't happening

thatguy69 01-16-2018 08:05 PM

Yeah he's gonna get hosed. And that "diesel tech" sounds like he's really got it going on.

Sent from my SM-N910V using Tapatalk

BRE 01-16-2018 08:43 PM

Oh he’s completely phucked now... should have never even walked into the dealer with it. If he wanted their warranty, he shouldn’t have deleted it.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro

biggy238 01-16-2018 09:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mark Nixon (Post 2652322)
It's not out of the realm of possibility that it simply dropped a valve, killing the injector in the process.
I've had a couple 13+ in here that did just that, no rhyme or reason.

If it just locked the pintle open, you might get very lucky and it didn't do any damage, but 50 miles is like an eternity on a wounded engine.

Mark.

Are the valves friction welded? I assume they are.

Sent from my XT1575 using Tapatalk

CorneliusRox 01-16-2018 09:31 PM

I will say, he's got a way with words or something. He previously got his truck warrantied while it was deleted. They asked him about the delete and he told them it left him stranded on a trip so he had it removed and they still replaced his CP3. That was only ~20,000 miles ago or so. Dealer told him 'no', so he wrote to FCA. I'll let you guys know what happens.

Mark, you can still send me a PM on a longblock.

smokinVE 01-16-2018 10:05 PM

At a minimum he can get what he paid for his extended warranty back from said company.

I would NOT take the truck off the dealerships property until they come up with a solution to what they've done, don't sign any papers wait for a decision from the general manager/service manager and the FCA.

Read laws in your state about extended warranty. Here we have a "previous condition" clause. If it was deleted when he bought the extended warranty they would have to honor it. (Probably varies by state?). Only thing they could hang him on is if there is a box that was checked that said something like "no modifications" or something of that nature. AND that would only apply if he filled out the paper work, if a dealer did then it's on them.

They attempted to mess with an engine that was already "declined" by extended warranty and I assume your buddy approved no further diagnosis. They shouldn't have been trying to mess with it.....

Mark Nixon 01-16-2018 10:15 PM

Regardless whether he deleted it or not, I'm under the impression that it didn't have a hole in the block when it arrived at the dealer and now it does.

It's also not a stretch to say or think that the damage that was done, while in their possession, was intentional.

I'm still not convinced that's an oil cooler problem, CorneliusRox. :hehe:

Mark.

CorneliusRox 01-17-2018 08:57 AM

I was busy last night with my own stuff, so I'll have to talk with him this morning and see what he did. I'm with you guys, I wouldn't touch it, and I'd get some sort of investigator out there.
If nothing else, I feel like they owe him a working short block. But that's assuming everything else was messed up and we don't know that for sure yet.
I can't wait to get the head off of this thing. I am sure I'll be able to tell if a valve or injector tip had been bouncing around for a long time, or if it was just a hydro-lock issue.

WUnderwood 01-17-2018 09:52 AM

What is FCA?

CorneliusRox 01-17-2018 10:24 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by WUnderwood (Post 2652397)
What is FCA?

Fiat Chrysler Automobiles


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