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| General Diesel Tech Farm equipment, Medium Duty, Big Rigs, and other General discussion can be found in here. |
05-14-2016, 09:45 AM
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#21
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Name: SmokinCAT
Title: Cheap and Easy.
Status: Not Here
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Hillsboro, Oh
Member`s Gallery
Posts: 3,162
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Advance mode on an MVT engine was never that far retarded, usually closer to .060-.065"
If a person builds an engine and plans on running a 1.25" gear pump then they do need to retard past .070", the fueling capability of that pump down low is what causes issues. Even with an injector upgrade the stock .75" pump is more then enough, if you want the engine to lug then you bought the wrong engine.
The funny thing about timing and Bruce's articles is that they suggest going to a MVT cam with more injector travel, at their suggestion of .080" this is a little less of a percentage of travel on a .266" then .070 is at .224"
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07-01-2016, 09:05 AM
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#22
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Name: Leiffi
Title: Too Much Time
Status: Not Here
Join Date: Jan 2013
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Posts: 1,381
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How common has normal rotation turbo been in 400s ? Engine in the pic should be 400 hp from around -90.
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07-04-2016, 05:58 AM
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#23
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Name: Leiffi
Title: Too Much Time
Status: Not Here
Join Date: Jan 2013
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Posts: 1,381
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It's NTE 400-20 , seems like E means european ? It is made in Great Britain. Maybe they used normal rotation turbo for better parts availability ?
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07-04-2016, 08:38 AM
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#24
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Name: SmokinCAT
Title: Cheap and Easy.
Status: Not Here
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Hillsboro, Oh
Member`s Gallery
Posts: 3,162
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Leiffi
It's NTE 400-20 , seems like E means european ? It is made in Great Britain. Maybe they used normal rotation turbo for better parts availability ?
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I believe that is correct that the E is for European. That is a unique manifold to say the least, I have only found them in certain CPL listings but never been able to find a serial number to look up any details on one.
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07-04-2016, 11:58 AM
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#25
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Name: Leiffi
Title: Too Much Time
Status: Not Here
Join Date: Jan 2013
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Posts: 1,381
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SmokinCAT
I believe that is correct that the E is for European. That is a unique manifold to say the least, I have only found them in certain CPL listings but never been able to find a serial number to look up any details on one.
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Tag is badly corroded and partially painted, hard to see anything. I think it says timing code is CO and injector travel 225, CPL might be 500 ?
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07-04-2016, 12:23 PM
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#26
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Name: SmokinCAT
Title: Cheap and Easy.
Status: Not Here
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Hillsboro, Oh
Member`s Gallery
Posts: 3,162
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CPL is a 651 going off of that serial number.
Cam and pistons are the same setup as the 676cpl over here, says turbo is a HC3B.
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07-04-2016, 12:35 PM
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#27
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Name: Leiffi
Title: Too Much Time
Status: Not Here
Join Date: Jan 2013
Member`s Gallery
Posts: 1,381
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SmokinCAT
CPL is a 651 going off of that serial number.
Cam and pistons are the same setup as the 676cpl over here, says turbo is a HC3B.
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Is that BC 3 or 4 ?
What that timing code says ? We didnt have emission regulation back then, only smoke test, so the timing might not be too retarded.
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07-04-2016, 01:13 PM
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#28
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Name: SmokinCAT
Title: Cheap and Easy.
Status: Not Here
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Hillsboro, Oh
Member`s Gallery
Posts: 3,162
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Leiffi
Is that BC 3 or 4 ?
What that timing code says ? We didnt have emission regulation back then, only smoke test, so the timing might not be too retarded.
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Timing at .0628", I would consider it a 3, doesn't look like it has low flow cooling but was built in 92.
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07-04-2016, 04:10 PM
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#29
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Name: Leiffi
Title: Too Much Time
Status: Not Here
Join Date: Jan 2013
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Posts: 1,381
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SmokinCAT
Timing at .0628", I would consider it a 3, doesn't look like it has low flow cooling but was built in 92.
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CPL676 had high lift cam ?
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07-04-2016, 09:04 PM
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#30
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Name: SmokinCAT
Title: Cheap and Easy.
Status: Not Here
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Hillsboro, Oh
Member`s Gallery
Posts: 3,162
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Leiffi
CPL676 had high lift cam ?
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Yes, but this is only the increased travel at the exhaust valve. Injector travel was standard, 676 was timed at .070".
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07-04-2016, 09:08 PM
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#31
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Name: SmokinCAT
Title: Cheap and Easy.
Status: Not Here
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Hillsboro, Oh
Member`s Gallery
Posts: 3,162
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Leiffi
CPL676 had high lift cam ?
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The larger injector travel cams were mostly MVT engines with the movable cam followers, I have not figured out if they have a slight increase in valve travel or not, this is a possibility as they use a unique piston in the twin turbo engines.
There are some high HP generator engines that have different builds as well, I wanted to get a cam from one of these but the only one in the cummins parts system was in Belgium.
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07-05-2016, 01:39 AM
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#32
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Name: Leiffi
Title: Too Much Time
Status: Not Here
Join Date: Jan 2013
Member`s Gallery
Posts: 1,381
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SmokinCAT
Yes, but this is only the increased travel at the exhaust valve. Injector travel was standard, 676 was timed at .070".
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Yes thats what I meant, like BC4.
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07-05-2016, 01:44 AM
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#33
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Name: Leiffi
Title: Too Much Time
Status: Not Here
Join Date: Jan 2013
Member`s Gallery
Posts: 1,381
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SmokinCAT
The larger injector travel cams were mostly MVT engines with the movable cam followers, I have not figured out if they have a slight increase in valve travel or not, this is a possibility as they use a unique piston in the twin turbo engines.
There are some high HP generator engines that have different builds as well, I wanted to get a cam from one of these but the only one in the cummins parts system was in Belgium.
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What is special in that generator cam ?
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07-05-2016, 02:47 AM
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#34
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Name: SmokinCAT
Title: Cheap and Easy.
Status: Not Here
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Hillsboro, Oh
Member`s Gallery
Posts: 3,162
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Leiffi
What is special in that generator cam ?
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Only cam to combine .266" injector travel with high exhaust lift.
I am trying something different in using a cam from a NT88 engine that had less rocker ratio then mine, don't know if it will work.
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07-05-2016, 03:50 AM
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#35
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Name: Leiffi
Title: Too Much Time
Status: Not Here
Join Date: Jan 2013
Member`s Gallery
Posts: 1,381
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SmokinCAT
Only cam to combine .266" injector travel with high exhaust lift.
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That would be interesting cam. I have been thinking how much you would lose in exhaust flow if twin turbo cam was used in BC4 ? Of course injector cam can be reground to anything but I dont know how long those will live if truck is used for OTR work. In racing and pulling they do fine but they are not driven thousands of kilometers.
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07-05-2016, 04:12 AM
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#36
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Name: SmokinCAT
Title: Cheap and Easy.
Status: Not Here
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Hillsboro, Oh
Member`s Gallery
Posts: 3,162
|
Quote:
Originally Posted by Leiffi
That would be interesting cam. I have been thinking how much you would lose in exhaust flow if twin turbo cam was used in BC4 ? Of course injector cam can be reground to anything but I dont know how long those will live if truck is used for OTR work. In racing and pulling they do fine but they are not driven thousands of kilometers.
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That's why I'm trying what I am, with my rocker ration injector travel is around .335 with a factory cam.
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07-05-2016, 04:55 AM
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#37
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Name: Leiffi
Title: Too Much Time
Status: Not Here
Join Date: Jan 2013
Member`s Gallery
Posts: 1,381
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SmokinCAT
That's why I'm trying what I am, with my rocker ration injector travel is around .335 with a factory cam.
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I don't know why it wouldnt work if nothing is hitting anywhere ?
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07-05-2016, 05:02 AM
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#38
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Name: SmokinCAT
Title: Cheap and Easy.
Status: Not Here
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Hillsboro, Oh
Member`s Gallery
Posts: 3,162
|
Quote:
Originally Posted by Leiffi
I don't know why it wouldnt work if nothing is hitting anywhere ?
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Still have to do a final clearance check, going to do break in with stock 400 injectors and cut the fuel pressure back to around 200psi, this will give me an idea of if it will be useable on the road.
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07-05-2016, 05:13 AM
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#39
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Name: SmokinCAT
Title: Cheap and Easy.
Status: Not Here
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Hillsboro, Oh
Member`s Gallery
Posts: 3,162
|
Timing is a shot in the dark, in relation to the amount of lift to the setting then I'm still advanced, I don't if I will be too far advance to have low rpm usability or not with my bigger injectors.
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07-05-2016, 06:50 AM
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#40
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Name: Leiffi
Title: Too Much Time
Status: Not Here
Join Date: Jan 2013
Member`s Gallery
Posts: 1,381
|
Quote:
Originally Posted by SmokinCAT
Timing is a shot in the dark, in relation to the amount of lift to the setting then I'm still advanced, I don't if I will be too far advance to have low rpm usability or not with my bigger injectors.
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PT timing is more about when it ends, lift has not much to do with it.
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