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Old 12-26-2019, 03:08 PM   #1
56cummins

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96mm vs 102mm s400 turbine

Forced Induction and VS Racing offer the gt50 turbine s400. Has anybody done a back to back test in a compound setup?


How do the thrust bearings compare between a gt50 vs s400? Would one be better off to get a gt5018 or s488/102?
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Old 12-26-2019, 03:21 PM   #2
jasonc

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I've heard they use a china turbine wheel from a couple people that know. It caught my attention also, I'm limited by my 96 turbine.
Next move would be go to a gt55, and big money.
Anyway was warned about it on a diesel app. I'm not knocking the F1 company at all.
But have any of the 102 turbines been ran on a diesel?
 
Old 12-26-2019, 04:46 PM   #3
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We have ran 4 different gt50 based Precision turbos without one problem. From 1160 to 15xx fwhp. I have been told by a reliable source that precision uses a chinese gt50 tw. I think it's an awesome middle ground wheel. We ran and tested it in the 1.08 and 1.39 AR housing.
How it performs stuffed into an s400 ex housing I dont know.....
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Old 12-26-2019, 05:14 PM   #4
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The GT50 turbine is 91/99mm.
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Old 12-26-2019, 05:26 PM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Smokem View Post
The GT50 turbine is 91/99mm.
Ah, that's right. So what turbine are they putting into the 400's?

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Old 12-26-2019, 05:40 PM   #6
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VSR Next Gen 88mm Slip-Fit T6 VSRacing

I bet they would get in **** if they straight copied it. Its in the listing as "gt50".
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Old 12-26-2019, 05:55 PM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ikeG View Post
We have ran 4 different gt50 based Precision turbos without one problem. From 1160 to 15xx fwhp. I have been told by a reliable source that precision uses a chinese gt50 tw. I think it's an awesome middle ground wheel. We ran and tested it in the 1.08 and 1.39 AR housing.
How it performs stuffed into an s400 ex housing I dont know.....
What compressor wheel are y'all running?
 
Old 12-26-2019, 06:06 PM   #8
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What compressor wheel are y'all running?
All singles btw. Two clipped versions, 2.6 mwe, and a 3.0 smooth. Also ran a 76mm version for 3.0 smooth. Then ran a PT8891 that engine dynod over 1500 on one pass. Later dialed that tune in via data logging on the track, so I'm sure it was more later on.
Like I stated, the gt50 platform that precision uses treated us extremely well. I know the bigger names in pulling used it for a short time too, but have moved up to the 55 line.
In my opinion, but admittedly little experience with compounds, the gt50 has to be a nice upgrade over the 96bw stuff without going crazy big(gt55 or hx82). So I'd be very tempted to try one of the 400s they are putting the similar tw in.

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Old 12-26-2019, 08:58 PM   #9
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Genuine borg 96 is tried and true, whatever fi is stuffing into a borg cartridge “102” is most certainly and aftermarket turbine wheel. Not bashing at all I personally use Jose’s products, just fyi
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Old 12-26-2019, 10:23 PM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by blackmega3500 View Post
There's alot of 6 and 7sec 1/4 cars running his stuff. It's difficult to say, seems alot of guys running his GTR builds and of course the ETR.

https://m.facebook.com/pg/Forcedinductions/posts/

https://m.facebook.com/jose.zayas.50?pn_ref=story
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Double
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Originally Posted by blackmega3500 View Post
There's alot of 6 and 7sec 1/4 cars running his stuff. It's difficult to say, seems alot of guys running his GTR builds and of course the ETR.

https://m.facebook.com/pg/Forcedinductions/posts/

https://m.facebook.com/jose.zayas.50?pn_ref=story
I have never seen nut hugging on the level you are at.

Wipe your chin.
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Old 01-02-2020, 02:17 PM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 56cummins View Post
Forced Induction and VS Racing offer the gt50 turbine s400. Has anybody done a back to back test in a compound setup?


How do the thrust bearings compare between a gt50 vs s400? Would one be better off to get a gt5018 or s488/102?
Garrett thrust bearing is crap.
 
Old 02-06-2020, 02:46 PM   #12
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What about the 93x85 or the 103x95?
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Old 02-06-2020, 09:52 PM   #13
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As long as the turbine creates enough shaft power to run the compressor the affect the design difference has on power is minimal. Certain turbine designs will run much more compressor for their given size compared to others, however this is typically only important in cases where there is a turbine size limit.

Below you can see a graph comparing drive pressure for several turbine wheel/housing combinations, these are only a few examples from that test which included over 15 combinations in total. Across the board with the same compressor inducer size the overall power differential between any two turbine configurations was less than 4% in total.

DPC.jpg
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Old 02-06-2020, 10:14 PM   #14
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I think FI offers their gen 2 turbine wheels in different sizes now. Looked pretty promising from feedbacks and dynos i have seen posted.
 
Old 02-07-2020, 06:35 AM   #15
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Originally Posted by Smokem View Post
As long as the turbine creates enough shaft power to run the compressor the affect the design difference has on power is minimal. Certain turbine designs will run much more compressor for their given size compared to others, however this is typically only important in cases where there is a turbine size limit.

Below you can see a graph comparing drive pressure for several turbine wheel/housing combinations, these are only a few examples from that test which included over 15 combinations in total. Across the board with the same compressor inducer size the overall power differential between any two turbine configurations was less than 4% in total.

Attachment 73901
Holy crap that HX60 is a rockstar huh?
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Old 02-07-2020, 08:12 AM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Smokem View Post
As long as the turbine creates enough shaft power to run the compressor the affect the design difference has on power is minimal. Certain turbine designs will run much more compressor for their given size compared to others, however this is typically only important in cases where there is a turbine size limit.

Below you can see a graph comparing drive pressure for several turbine wheel/housing combinations, these are only a few examples from that test which included over 15 combinations in total. Across the board with the same compressor inducer size the overall power differential between any two turbine configurations was less than 4% in total.

Attachment 73901
97/92mm hx60, or one of the smaller ones?
 
Old 02-07-2020, 08:45 AM   #17
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Holy crap that HX60 is a rockstar huh?
Yes, and far too overlooked in the performance world outside of pulling. Holsets scare people because you can't pull up a performance catalog and pick what you want.
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Old 02-07-2020, 11:43 AM   #18
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Holy crap that HX60 is a rockstar huh?
Personally I'm not a big fan of the HX60, but you cannot deny they are hard to beat in the drive pressure vs boost category. Be aware that even though it had the lowest drive, it did not make the most power.

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97/92mm hx60, or one of the smaller ones?
Yes it was the 3.6" turbine.
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Old 02-07-2020, 11:57 AM   #19
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Personally I'm not a big fan of the HX60, but you cannot deny they are hard to beat in the drive pressure vs boost category. Be aware that even though it had the lowest drive, it did not make the most power.
What outperforms it if I may ask?
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Old 02-07-2020, 02:17 PM   #20
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What outperforms it if I may ask?
In this particular instance, the GT50 in a smaller housing than shown. Generally speaking the GT50, S400, and HX60 are all close in power production in most cases.
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