Advertisement
If this is your first visit, be sure to check out the FAQ by clicking the link above. You may have to register before you can post: click the register link above to proceed. To start viewing messages, select the forum that you want to visit from the selection below.

Home Who's Online Today's Posts HP Calculator CompD Gift Shop Mark Forums Read
Go Back   Competition Diesel.Com - Bringing The BEST Together > Vendor Row > Sponsor Forums > Stalnaker Racing Services
Register Members List Timeslips EFI Live Library Invite Your Friends FAQ Calendar Mark Forums Read

Closed Thread
 
Thread Tools
Old 10-27-2017, 04:13 PM   #1
Bodacious
 
Bodacious's Avatar

Name: Bodacious
Title: Comp Diesel Sponsor
Status: Not Here
Join Date: Jul 2013
Location: Weston, WV
Member`s Gallery
Posts: 2,146
My Engine Idea

This is really not my idea. Just the use of what I see. Hopefully. lol

Take a look at what German Engineers at VW have been showing us for years. Lol, not the oil pump bolt, the cut-away of the engine. lol

Click the image to open in full size.

Well, it really doesn't seem like much. The engine design has been around for quite some time. However, one night in my Brother-in-Laws garage, it hit me like a "Flash of Genius" so to speak.

His son was doing a head gasket job on a little Jetta that had a 2.8LVR6 engine. At first glance I just thought it was a four cylinder. Then I seen the underside of the head.

Lots of crazy ideas started flying around and a month or so later I had the latest and greatest VR6 in my shop. This is a 2013 "Direct Injected" gasoline 3.6L VR6. Sorry for the sideway pics.

Click the image to open in full size.
__________________
" 'Careful who you argue with on the internet. Others might not know they are idiots.' "

Last edited by Bodacious; 10-27-2017 at 04:16 PM.
 
Old 10-27-2017, 04:24 PM   #2
DDually
 
DDually's Avatar

Name: DDually
Title: Still spooling..
Status: Not Here
Join Date: Nov 2009
Member`s Gallery
Posts: 2,076
Wait.... So what's your idea? I'm confused
__________________
2008 Cummings 6spd with matching bumper and grill and Banks

2001 VW TDI 5spd with an improper tune and a slipping clutch
 
Old 10-27-2017, 04:24 PM   #3
Bodacious
 
Bodacious's Avatar

Name: Bodacious
Title: Comp Diesel Sponsor
Status: Not Here
Join Date: Jul 2013
Location: Weston, WV
Member`s Gallery
Posts: 2,146
This is a good video to watch on the engine: VR6 Engine - Explained - YouTube

I had weighed the engine some time ago and really became excited. I went back through and found the pics. I had to go back down to the shop and re-weigh everything because I thought the scale had somehow been damaged.

Click the image to open in full size.

I thought this might not be a fair assessment. So, I grabbed an S-480 and situated it on top of the VR6. The engine hoist adapter is still hooked to the engine as well.

Click the image to open in full size.

Click the image to open in full size.
__________________
" 'Careful who you argue with on the internet. Others might not know they are idiots.' "
 
Old 10-27-2017, 04:27 PM   #4
Bodacious
 
Bodacious's Avatar

Name: Bodacious
Title: Comp Diesel Sponsor
Status: Not Here
Join Date: Jul 2013
Location: Weston, WV
Member`s Gallery
Posts: 2,146
...addition of a P7100 injection pump:

Click the image to open in full size.

Click the image to open in full size.
__________________
" 'Careful who you argue with on the internet. Others might not know they are idiots.' "
 
Old 10-27-2017, 04:29 PM   #5
Bodacious
 
Bodacious's Avatar

Name: Bodacious
Title: Comp Diesel Sponsor
Status: Not Here
Join Date: Jul 2013
Location: Weston, WV
Member`s Gallery
Posts: 2,146
...and to be semi race ready weight, we need an exhaust manifold.

Click the image to open in full size.

Click the image to open in full size.
__________________
" 'Careful who you argue with on the internet. Others might not know they are idiots.' "
 
Old 10-27-2017, 04:31 PM   #6
Bodacious
 
Bodacious's Avatar

Name: Bodacious
Title: Comp Diesel Sponsor
Status: Not Here
Join Date: Jul 2013
Location: Weston, WV
Member`s Gallery
Posts: 2,146
So what does it all mean so far? Remember the all aluminum 3.0L BMW engines I tore apart? Remember the weight?

Click the image to open in full size.

Click the image to open in full size.

This 3.6L VR6 is an iron block and less than 2/3 the length of the BMW yet maintains close to the same width.
__________________
" 'Careful who you argue with on the internet. Others might not know they are idiots.' "

Last edited by Bodacious; 10-27-2017 at 04:33 PM.
 
Old 10-27-2017, 05:49 PM   #7
J-Pipes
 
J-Pipes's Avatar

Name: J-Pipes
Title: Too Much Time
Status: Not Here
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: Ohio
Member`s Gallery
Posts: 2,005
Cool!

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G930A using Tapatalk
__________________
2000 Dodge ext cab short bed, 6spd.
 
Old 10-27-2017, 07:43 PM   #8
Bodacious
 
Bodacious's Avatar

Name: Bodacious
Title: Comp Diesel Sponsor
Status: Not Here
Join Date: Jul 2013
Location: Weston, WV
Member`s Gallery
Posts: 2,146
Quote:
Originally Posted by DDually View Post
Wait.... So what's your idea? I'm confused
Suppose you took the VR6 design and swelled it up to say a 4.88" stroke and a 5" bore?
__________________
" 'Careful who you argue with on the internet. Others might not know they are idiots.' "
 
Old 10-27-2017, 08:44 PM   #9
Bodacious
 
Bodacious's Avatar

Name: Bodacious
Title: Comp Diesel Sponsor
Status: Not Here
Join Date: Jul 2013
Location: Weston, WV
Member`s Gallery
Posts: 2,146
Dangit!! In post #1, I meant to point out that you are looking at the back of the engine. All cam timing happens back there.
__________________
" 'Careful who you argue with on the internet. Others might not know they are idiots.' "
 
Old 10-27-2017, 09:53 PM   #10
jasonc

Name: jasonc
Title: Too Much Time
Status: Not Here
Join Date: Nov 2009
Member`s Gallery
Posts: 2,643
Being direct injected the design could be diesel in theory, are you planning on making a billet block and all the rest just off this design?
 
Old 10-27-2017, 11:32 PM   #11
SmokeShow
 
SmokeShow's Avatar

Name: SmokeShow
Title: Too Much Time
Status: Not Here
Join Date: Apr 2006
Member`s Gallery
Posts: 4,431
My interest is peaked...
__________________
Mitch

IG: @_mitch_ratliff_

'14 Ford F150 FX4 SuperCrew, w/ 3.5L EcoBoost, bone stock

83 GMC K30 CC SB 4WD awaiting D/A chassis swap
 
Old 10-28-2017, 02:30 AM   #12
Bodacious
 
Bodacious's Avatar

Name: Bodacious
Title: Comp Diesel Sponsor
Status: Not Here
Join Date: Jul 2013
Location: Weston, WV
Member`s Gallery
Posts: 2,146
Quote:
Originally Posted by jasonc View Post
Being direct injected the design could be diesel in theory, are you planning on making a billet block and all the rest just off this design?
Exactly. My first plan is to find someone competent enough to get some injectors in place of the spark plugs and hang a pump on it.

Hopefully, with a little luck, it will start up and run. I know I'm going to need help figuring out just what kind of spray pattern to go with. The design must create some decent swirl.

I bought another head so I will get some pics up of the combustion chamber. It looks nothing like a modern diesel combustion chamber so I'm a little worried here. lol

Looking forward, if the little 3.6L does run, I found a 4.4L stroker kit in Europe that will fit in the 3.6 block. I'm not hearing good things about this kit.

I priced a centroid A-560, 5-axis CNC milling machine. For around $250k, I could have the machine setting in my shop. No tooling, just setting there and this money includes training.

With this being said, I can do a whole lot of hand grinding and cutting. lol In actuality, just so long as everything is close enough to final machine work, conventional equipment can be used to finish the work.

Scott Law (Chipmaker) made me realize that simple machining fact. Scott also had a crazy idea to weld a block together. Instead of cutting material away to create the block, you weld one together. I didn't give it much thought until I spoke with a few smaller shops willing to do my cutting for me. As much as I'd like to be able to hire them, I'll never get this thing off the ground spending that kind of money. So, as crazy as it sounds, I'm gonna try to weld a block together. I spoke with a fella who has repaired an aluminum block or two and he said it was genius. We may see. lol
__________________
" 'Careful who you argue with on the internet. Others might not know they are idiots.' "

Last edited by Bodacious; 10-28-2017 at 02:34 AM.
 
Old 10-28-2017, 08:37 AM   #13
9724VF350
 
9724VF350's Avatar

Name: 9724VF350
Title: Tractor Guy
Status: Not Here
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Northeast Ohio
Member`s Gallery
Posts: 2,631
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bodacious View Post
Exactly.
Scott Law (Chipmaker) made me realize that simple machining fact. Scott also had a crazy idea to weld a block together. Instead of cutting material away to create the block, you weld one together. I didn't give it much thought until I spoke with a few smaller shops willing to do my cutting for me. As much as I'd like to be able to hire them, I'll never get this thing off the ground spending that kind of money. So, as crazy as it sounds, I'm gonna try to weld a block together. I spoke with a fella who has repaired an aluminum block or two and he said it was genius. We may see. lol
Fabricated blocks have been done quite a few times in tractor pulling. Do you have a CAD program?
__________________
97 F350 4X4 CC Dually 5spd 24V 913 S300/HT3B Ranch Hand.
Playtoy-Oliver 1655. 12V now, 13mm, S475


Wife's ride-03 Excursion 12V swap in the works.
 
Old 10-28-2017, 08:37 AM   #14
Bodacious
 
Bodacious's Avatar

Name: Bodacious
Title: Comp Diesel Sponsor
Status: Not Here
Join Date: Jul 2013
Location: Weston, WV
Member`s Gallery
Posts: 2,146
I have been researching combustion chamber and piston design a little. I know now why pistons in conventional direct injected engines have bowls. Among other reasons, the bowl is designed to swirl the air as the piston ascends.

These pics are of an additional head I picked up. I have yet to pull the head off the test engine but the combustion chambers are the same. I will need to pull the head regardless and will study the piston tops then.

Really reaching out there, lol, it would be nice to build a Unit Injector System to run off the available cam lobes.

Click the image to open in full size.

Click the image to open in full size.

Click the image to open in full size.

Click the image to open in full size.

Click the image to open in full size.

Click the image to open in full size.

Click the image to open in full size.

Click the image to open in full size.
__________________
" 'Careful who you argue with on the internet. Others might not know they are idiots.' "
 
Old 10-29-2017, 03:12 AM   #15
Bodacious
 
Bodacious's Avatar

Name: Bodacious
Title: Comp Diesel Sponsor
Status: Not Here
Join Date: Jul 2013
Location: Weston, WV
Member`s Gallery
Posts: 2,146
Quote:
Originally Posted by 9724VF350 View Post
Fabricated blocks have been done quite a few times in tractor pulling. Do you have a CAD program?
I bought Viacad. I designed and drew a few things with it. IMHO, to learn all it has to offer, I may as well get up to date with AutoCAD.

I haven't used AutoCAD since 2006. Not sure I could even draw a line with the new stuff.
__________________
" 'Careful who you argue with on the internet. Others might not know they are idiots.' "
 
Old 10-29-2017, 08:00 AM   #16
Tobin
 
Tobin's Avatar

Name: Tobin
Title: 5.7 IDI Powaa!
Status: Not Here
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Orlando, FL
Member`s Gallery
Posts: 1,052
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bodacious View Post
I bought Viacad. I designed and drew a few things with it. IMHO, to learn all it has to offer, I may as well get up to date with AutoCAD.

I haven't used AutoCAD since 2006. Not sure I could even draw a line with the new stuff.
AutoCAD is garbage.
__________________
2006 Dodge QCLB 4x4 Goerend 48RE

1977 F250 "High Boy" 12 valve, 180 pump, 5x.014, S363/S475, Goerend 47RH, NP271, 2007 D60/Sterling 10.5, 40" Toyo MTs

1995 Dodge 2500 4x4 47RH SCLB
 
Old 10-29-2017, 08:57 AM   #17
mhuggler

Name: mhuggler
Title: One piece at a time
Status: Not Here
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Uno, Pa.
Member`s Gallery
Posts: 618
I've always been curious to know exactly how crazy high are the piston skirt side loading figures for that engine.
__________________
2002 2500 4x4 ETH/DEE-F1 Mach 5's/62/65/12/Smarty/ATS Ex.manifold/AFE intake/TST Comp./.020 marine gasket/o-ringed/ARP studs/5"stacks/Airdog 150/Isspro guages/Southbend 3600 DD/3.54 gears/leveling kit/Bilstein 5100frt,5150rr/37" BFG A/T's on 18" Eagle 114's/Borgeson SS/DSS
 
Old 10-29-2017, 12:33 PM   #18
Bodacious
 
Bodacious's Avatar

Name: Bodacious
Title: Comp Diesel Sponsor
Status: Not Here
Join Date: Jul 2013
Location: Weston, WV
Member`s Gallery
Posts: 2,146
Quote:
AutoCAD is garbage.
I haven't had the real need to use any CAD tools. I have some drawings here I did with my old manual drafting tools.

This ViaCad deal, we bought at Wal-Mart, is OK. It isn't accurate enough to do mechanical drawings.

Tobin,

What would you suggest for a fella in my position? What is out there you might approve of??

Quote:
exactly how crazy high are the piston skirt side loading figures for that engine
I don't have a clue. Any reason they would be much different than an old 12 valve??
__________________
" 'Careful who you argue with on the internet. Others might not know they are idiots.' "
 
Old 10-29-2017, 03:15 PM   #19
9724VF350
 
9724VF350's Avatar

Name: 9724VF350
Title: Tractor Guy
Status: Not Here
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Northeast Ohio
Member`s Gallery
Posts: 2,631
I started out with Solidworks while knowing nothing about CAD. I caught on quickly and love it. I tried to use autocad once and absolutely despised it. You can pick up PC's on eBay with Solidworks already on them pretty reasonable.
__________________
97 F350 4X4 CC Dually 5spd 24V 913 S300/HT3B Ranch Hand.
Playtoy-Oliver 1655. 12V now, 13mm, S475


Wife's ride-03 Excursion 12V swap in the works.
 
Old 10-29-2017, 08:21 PM   #20
kleann
 
kleann's Avatar

Name: kleann
Title: VP44 pwr
Status: Not Here
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Down yonder
Member`s Gallery
Posts: 4,334
AutoCAD is more for 2d modeling. Solidworks is nice for 3d. Fusion 360 (which is made by the same company as autocad) seems like it might be worth a try for you considering the low cost of it.
 
Closed Thread

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 01:41 AM.

 


Powered by vBulletin
Copyright ©2000 - 2018, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright ©2006 - 2018, CompetitionDiesel.com
all information found on this site is property of www.competitiondiesel.com