blu_by_u's P-pump swap

[blu_by_u]

We pushed the truck completely outside for this event. I just wasn't sure if we were going to get a bunch of smoke or what. Right off the bat I found that the final filter just wasn't quite tight. Easy fix and brought out the oil drain pan just in case there were more leaks. I cracked the #1 and #3 lines to help bleed the injection lines. That's usually all I did for VP trucks. It was nice having the AirDog connected to the "Run" circuit on the key switch. Seemed to help a lot with priming.

After it started I wasn't thrilled by the white smoke out the tailpipe. That combined with the popping while trying to raise the rpm, yet smooth idle (I couldn't hear any misses) leads me to believe that the timing needs to be advanced more. I tried setting it for 18 degrees, but I'm wondering if I need to double check my TDC mark on the front pulley.

2012-08-07 Test Fire :: VIDEO0182.mp4 video by blu_by_u - Photobucket

2012-08-07 Test Fire :: VIDEO0182.mp4 video by blu_by_u - Photobucket

2012-08-07 Test Fire :: VID-20120807-00007.mp4 video by blu_by_u - Photobucket

2012-08-07 Test Fire :: VID-20120807-00007.mp4 video by blu_by_u - Photobucket

2012-08-07 Test Fire :: VIDEO0182.mp4 video by blu_by_u - Photobucket

2012-08-07 Test Fire :: VIDEO0182.mp4 video by blu_by_u - Photobucket

[Tate]

Let the engine warm up and see if the white smoke goes away? My dually used to do that with 12mm pump and smaller injectors. It would go real quiet when it was doing that as well. Drove it for about 2-3 minutes and it wouldn't do it anymore.

[AJenson]

Recheck and set your timing.

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[blu_by_u]

The first thing I did this evening was to double and triple check my TDC mark. It was right on the money. Then I started to double check what how much lift the number 1 plunger had at TDC when I suddenly realized that I had highlighted the wrong column on the timing chart that I printed off! So instead of the timing being set at 18 degrees (~5.3mm lift), it was actually set at roughly 10.25 degrees. So I simply rotated the engine until the pump read 6.8mm lift, popped the gear loose, turned the crank back to TDC, then torqued the pump nut back on to 150ft-lbs. I double checked to see if pump had slipped while I torqued it down and it slipped to about 17.25 degrees. Close enough at this point!

So long story short, the timing was retarded. Here's another video of a test run (bad quality of course).

2012-08-07 Test Fire :: Timingsetat17deginsteadof10degBTDC.mp4 video by blu_by_u - Photobucket

2012-08-07 Test Fire :: Timingsetat17deginsteadof10degBTDC.mp4 video by blu_by_u - Photobucket

[AJenson]

I would t set it any lower than 19*.

Sent from my DROID3 using Tapatalk 2

[blu_by_u]

AJenson, thanks for the advice. I imagine that I will eventually advance the timing some more later, but since it runs nice now, I'm going to leave it right there and finish getting everything put back together on it now. I really hope to have the front end put back on tomorrow evening. If I get enough miles on it to check for leaks and loose bolts and what-not, I'd like to pull the camper this weekend. But I'm not dead-set on that either.

[blu_by_u]

I got the front end put back together and filled with coolant. To minimize any air pockets in the head or block, I removed the thermostat and filled as much coolant from there as I could. Then I reinstalled the thermostat and housing and filled the rest from the radiator.

Then I ran the truck like this for about 18 minutes like the Colt Cams websites suggests to do. Notice there is only about 1/16th tank of fuel and it's still running? Big relief!


I don't think the neighbors were too impressed At least it was during the day unlike the one neighbor kid who needs to rev his old Ninja before he shuts it off, no matter how late it is.

After that was over I pulled the truck back into the garage. I noticed that there was a big fuel spot and also a big oil spot on the driveway. The fuel leak was easy to find, injector lines at the head. The oil leak, not so easy. The oil supply lines for the pump and power steering pump appear to be dry. So does the plug on the back side of the pump. While checking, I noticed the pump oil feed line was hitting the power steering resevior pretty hard.


Pretty simple fix: loosen the line, rotate a few degrees and retighten.


After some more investigation and a few short drives around it looks like the oil is leaking from all around the tappet cover. I installed a new 12 valve tappet cover so that I could move my breather off of the front cover and installed a new gasket. I'll be taking the pump off today to look into the tappet cover some more. Maybe there was a plug in the crankcase breather that I missed when I put it together??????

In the mean time, here are some pictures of the engine all installed and put together:


And yes I agree, I need a new Outerwears filter cover!

[heavyd1980]

Man that is awesome!!! I cant wait to get mine done now! Ive heard those tappet covers can be a huge pain!!! Good luck with the leak and great work on the truck and documenting it!!

[blu_by_u]

Thanks! I drove it to work last Tuesday (35 miles each way). It missed and leaked oil pretty bad again. Not too happy with all of that. I've been travelling for business since then too so I haven't been able to look into where the oil is leaking from either. When I saw the oil leaking in the parking lot at work it looked like it was dripping from the flywheel housing. So I really hope that it was just oil dripping from the tappet cover down to the flywheel housing and NOT THE REAR MAIN SEAL. If it is the tappet cover again, I can now see why people buy a billet cover with an O-ring seal! I'll be diving into it again this weekend.

[01Grizzly]

Very good write up and thread. I hope for your sake it is the tappet cover leaking too. When I did mine I put a 12v cover on it and thankfully haven't had any problems with it. I would suggest if you don't buy a billet cover to silicone the hell out of it.

[blu_by_u]

Originally Posted by 01Grizzly

Very good write up and thread. I hope for your sake it is the tappet cover leaking too. When I did mine I put a 12v cover on it and thankfully haven't had any problems with it. I would suggest if you don't buy a billet cover to silicone the hell out of it.

Thanks! If it is the rear main seal, I have an appointment at Chris Snyder's on Monday! I can pull the trans out and reinstall it just like I have done twice before, but I really need to get it back on the road soon. And as this thread proves, I'm not a speedy wrencher!

Otherwise if it is the tappet cover, then I'm going to do EXACTLY as you suggested! I already tried the minimal approach to silicone, now it's time to get serious.

[blu_by_u]

I found that there was definitely a leak at the tappet cover again. I RTV'd the crap out of it this time. Too bad that I'll have to wait until about this time tomorrow until I can drive it again since it takes 24 hours to cure. I can't hardly wait to see if it leaks again. This time I applied RTV on the block instead of the tappet cover. I know that I bumped the back side of the tappet cover on something the last time I put it together, so maybe I messed up some of the RTV that I applied.

Another thing that I noticed is that the aftermarket gasket that I used this time is about 0.030-0.040" thicker than the genuine Cummins tappet gasket. I had one of each because I had ordered an aftermarket gasket kit from Mumau, then later ordered a genuine tappet cover and genuine gasket from a dealer. I didn't realize that the tappet gasket was already in the kit, so I thought that the genuine gasket would be the best one to use originally. Now that I have a thicker aftermarket gasket on, maybe that will do the trick!

[CSnyder]

Originally Posted by blu_by_u

Thanks! If it is the rear main seal, I have an appointment at Chris Snyder's on Monday! I can pull the trans out and reinstall it just like I have done twice before, but I really need to get it back on the road soon. And as this thread proves, I'm not a speedy wrencher!

Otherwise if it is the tappet cover, then I'm going to do EXACTLY as you suggested! I already tried the minimal approach to silicone, now it's time to get serious.

sounds like Im off the hook for Monday then!!! YAY!!!!

[blu_by_u]

Originally Posted by CSnyder

sounds like Im off the hook for Monday then!!! YAY!!!!

No offense, but I sure hope so! haha I'm still planning on making a run up there today to buy an intercooler off of you though. Oh, and maybe one of those fancy dancy ECM mounts?

[blu_by_u]

Today I drove up to Ramboyz and did a little horse trading and am now the proud owner of an intercooler with only 2 holes..... the inlet and outlet! Then later today with the help of a friend we swapped out the intercooler and finished installing the pump after I resealed the tappet cover last night and took it for a test drive. It wasn't long before something reminded me that I completely forgot to tighten a hose clamp. After that quick fix and wiping off any residual oil off of the oil pan and flywheel housing, we took it out again for another test drive. This time I hit over 40 psi of boost and everything held together. When we pulled back into the garage I couldn't find any drips on the cardboard that my friend put down under the engine/trans! I used a light and mirror to look for any traces along the tappet cover and couldn't find any! I'm not saying that it's completely leak free, but at this moment it sure appears to be!

I do have to confess that another change I made was to use my 24 valve front breather and tube. My plans are to lengthen that hose and bring it back to about the same location as the 12valve breather hose goes to and keep them both. Just in case crankcase pressure was part of my problem.

Tomorrow I am taking off work to start getting ready to pull the camper on a trip to Minnesota. I hope to get some videos soon of it running. I should be able to try swapping PCM's tomorrow to see if that cures my cruise control.

One thing that is still bugging me is the touchy throttle. I want to try backing the gov springs off one click each. Will I probably need to raise the idle after that? It idles around 750 now in neutral, A/C off.

[blu_by_u]

Originally Posted by blu_by_u

No offense, but I sure hope so! haha I'm still planning on making a run up there today to buy an intercooler off of you though. Oh, and maybe one of those fancy dancy ECM mounts?

Great seeing you again today Chris, thanks again for the good intercooler! It sure seems that there isn't any oil leaking from the rear main seal now.

[blu_by_u]

Originally Posted by blu_by_u

Today I drove up to Ramboyz and did a little horse trading and am now the proud owner of an intercooler with only 2 holes..... the inlet and outlet! Then later today with the help of a friend we swapped out the intercooler and finished installing the pump after I resealed the tappet cover last night and took it for a test drive. It wasn't long before something reminded me that I completely forgot to tighten a hose clamp. After that quick fix and wiping off any residual oil off of the oil pan and flywheel housing, we took it out again for another test drive. This time I hit over 40 psi of boost and everything held together. When we pulled back into the garage I couldn't find any drips on the cardboard that my friend put down under the engine/trans! I used a light and mirror to look for any traces along the tappet cover and couldn't find any! I'm not saying that it's completely leak free, but at this moment it sure appears to be!

I do have to confess that another change I made was to use my 24 valve front breather and tube. My plans are to lengthen that hose and bring it back to about the same location as the 12valve breather hose goes to and keep them both. Just in case crankcase pressure was part of my problem.

Tomorrow I am taking off work to start getting ready to pull the camper on a trip to Minnesota. I hope to get some videos soon of it running. I should be able to try swapping PCM's tomorrow to see if that cures my cruise control.

One thing that is still bugging me is the touchy throttle. I want to try backing the gov springs off one click each. Will I probably need to raise the idle after that? It idles around 750 now in neutral, A/C off.

I took the day off today and used the truck to run some errands. It didn't take long before it started leaking oil again. So I think I'm going to try using the 24valve tappet cover this time.

The other problem is that sometimes it lost prime when I shut it off. I noticed that the truck was parked on a slight uphill when it didn't want to start. For what it's worth, I have the Torq Tek OFV060HP overflow valve, which really is only an oriface with no real valve in it. Could that be my problem? I don't see any fuel below any of the injection lines at the head and the connections at the pump look dry too.

Any help or ideas are greatly appreciated.

[rockytopcummins]

Do you have to pump your throttle at all to start the truck? That's the only complaint I have about my swap. I turn the key on, let the Air Dog run for two or three seconds and if I don't mash the throttle one time it doesn't start. It only takes once, but I think I should be able to just push the clutch in and turn the key. I don't know if that's a p-pump thing or just something I need to adjust in the pump.

[Ktown6.0]

Originally Posted by blu_by_u

I took the day off today and used the truck to run some errands. It didn't take long before it started leaking oil again. So I think I'm going to try using the 24valve tappet cover this time.

The other problem is that sometimes it lost prime when I shut it off. I noticed that the truck was parked on a slight uphill when it didn't want to start. For what it's worth, I have the Torq Tek OFV060HP overflow valve, which really is only an oriface with no real valve in it. Could that be my problem? I don't see any fuel below any of the injection lines at the head and the connections at the pump look dry too.

Any help or ideas are greatly appreciated.

I don't have a Torq Tek, just the stock OFV in my pump and have this issue. However, it is only when the tank gets below 1/4 or 1/8. If I can leave it sit level, it is fine. If I have to park on an odd angle, then if it sits any long than say 15 minutes, it is a bear to start. If I keep a good amount of fuel in the tank, it is fine. When I switched from a Raptor 150 to an Air Dog II 165 it cured it for a little but, but has come back. No leaks that I can find.

[CSnyder]

Originally Posted by blu_by_u

Great seeing you again today Chris, thanks again for the good intercooler! It sure seems that there isn't any oil leaking from the rear main seal now.

Great seeing you too. Wish I would have had the straps to make you an ECM mount.