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Old 11-12-2008, 09:34 PM   #41
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Originally Posted by bh10 View Post
How many miles do you have? IMO Id rather spend the money on pushrods then tappets.

And also when it comes to cams Id go w/ someone who will build a cam with your specs in mind
Why?
 
Old 11-12-2008, 09:37 PM   #42
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Why?
Why what?
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Old 11-13-2008, 06:18 AM   #43
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Originally Posted by bh10 View Post
Why what?
Why would you rather spend the money on push tubes then tappets? That makes no sence to me. What we are talking about is can wear and how to prevent it yes it is good practis to chage push tubes when changing tappets but not as critical as the tappets. I just want to get to the bottom on why the cams are failing in the common rail trucks? I might also add its not just one cam supplyer its all of them!!
 
Old 11-13-2008, 06:52 AM   #44
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Well guys, thanks for the advice..

Like I said earlier...My Whole motor, block, etc has to come Out and Apart to go to the machine shop to get a make over....Had a boo boo!!
So new tappets will be ordered...I might even do push tubes....

I just want to do this ONCE and do it right!!!

It will be a Helix 2 cam going in....I've got the Ham. springs already....It would only make sense to have new tappets at least...

Thanks again guys....I'll keep you posted on the progress and results...

I can't stand my baby being hurt like this!!!
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Old 11-13-2008, 07:08 AM   #45
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Originally Posted by Big Swole View Post
Well guys, thanks for the advice..

Like I said earlier...My Whole motor, block, etc has to come Out and Apart to go to the machine shop to get a make over....Had a boo boo!!
So new tappets will be ordered...I might even do push tubes....

I just want to do this ONCE and do it right!!!

It will be a Helix 2 cam going in....I've got the Ham. springs already....It would only make sense to have new tappets at least...

Thanks again guys....I'll keep you posted on the progress and results...

I can't stand my baby being hurt like this!!!
Yeah If your engine is out I would def put new tappets in, It would't be anymore work. What kind of boo boo did we have? An expensive one I see.
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Old 11-13-2008, 07:10 AM   #46
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bad-Duvall View Post
Why would you rather spend the money on push tubes then tappets? That makes no sence to me. What we are talking about is can wear and how to prevent it yes it is good practis to chage push tubes when changing tappets but not as critical as the tappets. I just want to get to the bottom on why the cams are failing in the common rail trucks? I might also add its not just one cam supplyer its all of them!!
I'd think if there were a bunch of cams failing... there'd be a lot more talk about it. I've not seen anyone... recently anyway claim their cam has failed. I've also not seen any aftermarket tappets that claim to be better than stock. You say there's wear after 10 miles so what's going to be different if they're changed ? In 10 miles they'll be worn again.

Since I've changed to 110lbs springs a billet tubes, I do expect more than normal wear but, see no reason to upgrade tappets although the one's I have are only a year old. Guess I'll find out once I pull the cam.
 
Old 11-13-2008, 07:13 AM   #47
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By you takin the motor out you just saved your self lots-o-headach. lets just say you must be very very skilled to get the tappets back in.
 
Old 11-13-2008, 07:30 AM   #48
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I'd think if there were a bunch of cams failing... there'd be a lot more talk about it. I've not seen anyone... recently anyway claim their cam has failed. I've also not seen any aftermarket tappets that claim to be better than stock. You say there's wear after 10 miles so what's going to be different if they're changed ? In 10 miles they'll be worn again.

Since I've changed to 110lbs springs a billet tubes, I do expect more than normal wear but, see no reason to upgrade tappets although the one's I have are only a year old. Guess I'll find out once I pull the cam.

I dont mean that there are up-graded tappets the the stock tappets are fine. but said cam and said tappets are unique like finger prints and once they have ran together they will always have that patten in them. so what i mean with that is they are pairs like a bering and race you cant just change one.

Like i said i have pulled several after market cams they all look similar the nose of the cam pitting/flaking. there is a cause maby its hardness maby its the lack of zink.

Also in the last 2 years how many cams do you know of that have been installed ran 10,000+ mi then removed?
 
Old 11-13-2008, 07:38 AM   #49
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By you takin the motor out you just saved your self lots-o-headach. lets just say you must be very very skilled to get the tappets back in.
Yeah their tedious, A little 8mm Snap On bore scope camera comes in real handy to see down the push tube hole. That and having the engine parallel to the floor helps the plumb bob plug go in the hole a lil easier.
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Old 11-13-2008, 07:54 AM   #50
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I can def. see the point of having 2 brand new serfaces mating to each other during break in...That makes perfect since for those two to run together from the start...

I melted a piston ( #4) and the block is a little screwed too....Jeff looked at it when I got it all down.....I had to leave Tues. night to be on duty Wed and today...Going back down Friday, but I think Jeff was going to go ahead and get the block all the way out and start tarring it down to send to the machine shop....Ugh!!


So, with the block already out, Is it still hard to remove / replace the tappets????

Is there any REAL reason (performance or reliability wise) that I should change the push rods??? Don't need to spend anymore than nessessary for Obvious reasons!!!!!

Thanks!!
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Old 11-13-2008, 08:38 AM   #51
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No there will be no more labor involved installing new tappets, you have to remove the old ones if taking the block to a machine shop. With the Hamiltons Springs stiffer pushrods might be needed. But the Sportsman springs dont cause and push rod deflection.

Man those CR's are hell on pistons.
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Old 11-13-2008, 08:50 AM   #52
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the only reasone i see is if you go back with a re-grind cam then you may need .100 longer push tubes.
 
Old 11-13-2008, 08:54 AM   #53
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the only reasone i see is if you go back with a re-grind cam then you may need .100 longer push tubes.

The Helix 2 is done from a blank, Right???

Not gonna do a regrind....
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Old 11-13-2008, 08:57 AM   #54
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Right!
 
Old 11-13-2008, 09:56 AM   #55
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A couple if things that have happend over the summer has changed our ideas and policy on "drop-in" cams. Meaning installing a Helix 2 cam without changing the tappets.

In the early days we had either stock, Enterprise Engine, or Pro/Sportman Springs. All 3 of these springs have been very successful with our program of installing the Helix cams and using your old tappets. Saving time and energy on a cam install. Simplification was the idea.

Higher spring pressures (as of late) with a new cam and used tappets is starting to take its toll. The failures are still considered rare, but we have replaced 5 cams this past 6 months. In all the years since 2004, we have had no returns for worn lobes.

This is a direct result of higher spring pressures and todays oils having less of the good things we need to cut wear down for environmental concerns.

We now require that new tappets be installed if you are going to run high spring pressures. If you use stock, Enterprise Engine, or Pro/sportsman springs you can skip the new tappets and continue as always.
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Old 11-13-2008, 10:03 AM   #56
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A couple if things that have happend over the summer has changed our ideas and policy on "drop-in" cams. Meaning installing a Helix 2 cam without changing the tappets.

In the early days we had either stock, Enterprise Engine, or Pro/Sportman Springs. All 3 of these springs have been very successful with our program of installing the Helix cams and using your old tappets. Saving time and energy on a cam install. Simplification was the idea.

Higher spring pressures (as of late) with a new cam and used tappets is starting to take its toll. The failures are still considered rare, but we have replaced 5 cams this past 6 months. In all the years since 2004, we have had no returns for worn lobes.

This is a direct result of higher spring pressures and todays oils having less of the good things we need to cut wear down for environmental concerns.

We now require that new tappets be installed if you are going to run high spring pressures. If you use stock, Enterprise Engine, or Pro/sportsman springs you can skip the new tappets and continue as always.
Thank you Don for clarification on this!!

I can't wait to get your cam in there and the biggers injectors!!

I've seen some really big numbers from people using the combo with the air I'll have......Thanks again!!
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Old 11-13-2008, 10:18 AM   #57
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Originally Posted by Soup Nazi View Post
A couple if things that have happend over the summer has changed our ideas and policy on "drop-in" cams. Meaning installing a Helix 2 cam without changing the tappets.

In the early days we had either stock, Enterprise Engine, or Pro/Sportman Springs. All 3 of these springs have been very successful with our program of installing the Helix cams and using your old tappets. Saving time and energy on a cam install. Simplification was the idea.

Higher spring pressures (as of late) with a new cam and used tappets is starting to take its toll. The failures are still considered rare, but we have replaced 5 cams this past 6 months. In all the years since 2004, we have had no returns for worn lobes.

This is a direct result of higher spring pressures and todays oils having less of the good things we need to cut wear down for environmental concerns.

We now require that new tappets be installed if you are going to run high spring pressures. If you use stock, Enterprise Engine, or Pro/sportsman springs you can skip the new tappets and continue as always.
Thanks for clarifying. If you could answer one more question plz. Since my lifters have been mated with your cam for over a year now, ( that sounded ) they're obviously matched as far as wear. Since I now have the 110lbs springs, how do you think that will effect their wear on the cam / lifters ?

also what metals would show high in a oil analysis if the cam were wearing ?
 
Old 11-13-2008, 10:30 AM   #58
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Since my lifters have been mated with your cam for over a year now, ( that sounded )


LMAO!!

That did sound a little Sweet Ty!!!! lol
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Old 11-13-2008, 10:52 AM   #59
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I just got running a helix 2 with 50,000 miles on it over 2 years. In my opinion, I ran this truck pretty hard all the time and the cam came out better than I could have ever imagined. Since the motor is out, I'm sending the cam and tappets back to him for his inspection with a fine tooth comb.

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Old 11-13-2008, 12:53 PM   #60
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Thanks for clarifying. If you could answer one more question plz. Since my lifters have been mated with your cam for over a year now, ( that sounded ) they're obviously matched as far as wear. Since I now have the 110lbs springs, how do you think that will effect their wear on the cam / lifters ?

also what metals would show high in a oil analysis if the cam were wearing ?
I think that new tappets with a new cam and everything will be fine in your case.

Oil additives containing moly, phos, and zinc ar a great idea for cam wear.
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