Hardcore 6.4 Parts

[roachie]

About as many that want them for a Y block ford.

[92fordcummins]

Originally Posted by promodracer

I just have no idea how many guys would want a set of billet killer heads.
and what most people are willing to spend?
Thanks

I believe you have found the reason why this would not be a successful venture on your end. Everyone will want a set of billet heads but by the time you have done the research and actually produced the heads they will be out of most everyone's price range. You may sell a ton of them but what happens if not there is not a huge demand for billet 6.4 heads. There are easily 10 times the 12v cummins that would be interested in this if it would give them the advantage on the competition.

[BIGRPOWR]

Originally Posted by promodracer

I just have no idea how many guys would want a set of billet killer heads.
and what most people are willing to spend?
Thanks

unforunately most business endeavours dont start based on what some guys told you on the internet. they start with you.

[imelmo]

And I doubt anyone (on here at least) will buy any without first seeing how well they work on a truck.

[SINNER]

That's why this thread has been BS from the word Go... If you are looking to fill a niche market you start by producing parts and having a strong running truck, that will start the ball rolling. Then as demand spreads you invest money back into the company to produce more parts as the needs arise. You think for 1 second there is ANY high end diesel parts manufacturers that "researched" for the highest demand parts? No, they base what they build on customer demands in the real world not on the interweb. At this point there are 0 6.4's that have maxed out the flow capacities of a well ported 6.4 head. As a matter of fact I know of no 6.0's that have hit the wall as far as max potential of a 6.0 head. The durability of the 6.0 heads may increase the demand for a set of billet heads but then again how many people would drop 10k on a set? Hell most people shy away from a 8k set of twins for a 6.0 based on cost vs. return for the money. The ONLY aspect of diesel motor sports I see where you could anticipate a need in advance would be safety items to comply with newly made rules. Just like your comments about a "funny car engine" in your street car. A 2500 hp. KB in a street car is about as new and revolutionary as a back halfed street car. You do not see them every day but they have been around for decades. Hell there are 4.6 mod engines making that and getting 5-8mpg.

[promodracer]

Originally Posted by BIGRPOWR

unforunately most business endeavours dont start based on what some guys told you on the internet. they start with you.

Yea

[promodracer]

Originally Posted by SINNER

That's why this thread has been BS from the word Go... If you are looking to fill a niche market you start by producing parts and having a strong running truck, that will start the ball rolling. Then as demand spreads you invest money back into the company to produce more parts as the needs arise. You think for 1 second there is ANY high end diesel parts manufacturers that "researched" for the highest demand parts? No, they base what they build on customer demands in the real world not on the interweb. At this point there are 0 6.4's that have maxed out the flow capacities of a well ported 6.4 head. As a matter of fact I know of no 6.0's that have hit the wall as far as max potential of a 6.0 head. The durability of the 6.0 heads may increase the demand for a set of billet heads but then again how many people would drop 10k on a set? Hell most people shy away from a 8k set of twins for a 6.0 based on cost vs. return for the money. The ONLY aspect of diesel motor sports I see where you could anticipate a need in advance would be safety items to comply with newly made rules. Just like your comments about a "funny car engine" in your street car. A 2500 hp. KB in a street car is about as new and revolutionary as a back halfed street car. You do not see them every day but they have been around for decades. Hell there are 4.6 mod engines making that and getting 5-8mpg.

Name one 6.4 making 2500hp getting 5-8 mpg?

[imelmo]

Originally Posted by promodracer

Name one 6.4 making 2500hp getting 5-8 mpg?

He said 4.6, not 6.4.

.

[strokin'_tatsch]

ok for all the dodge guys on here that keeps telling the OP to go with cummins heads... this is sad, even i know that there are about to be new 12v heads released to the market very soon. i was just talking to them about it a couple weeks ago. LoL.

Now, i think it would be awesome to see a set of 7.3 heads hit the market, but i see something that keeps happening over and over on different parts that throw the price wayyyy up and out of reach. everyone keeps building these billet parts. you can have a 1000hp gasser(yes i went there. haha) with nothing of billet on it, but yet everyone thinks it's neccessary to have billet everything. its not neccessary. all that really matters is that the parts work as advertized and are strong(this doesn't mean they have to be billet). billet parts are awesome, but IMO the average guy can't afford all those parts which makes the demand that much less and prices stay way high. so for example lets look at Swamps new billet front cover that can hold a common rail setup, p-pump or HPOP on a 7.3. that kit will likely be over $10k. how many regular guys can afford $10k on a front cover and a pump? not me. now i don't think that the billet material would be needed for the front cover, but i haven't built any really high hp 7.3's either. i would bet tho if they had a way to make the cover from a different material to make it cheaper for them to make thus cheaper for us, the consumer, to buy then they would sell more of that part, thus more higher hp 7.3's appear.

same goes for rods IMO. You can get 4340 H beam or I beam rods for a 460 all day long for under $750 and they will hold gobs of power, but we do make more compression and stress on rods, but 7.3 rod prices are higher than a cats back..

i will continue to slowly build my 7.3, but i just build a complete 5.0 from top to bottom for what i could spend on a set of connecting rods, girdle, and pistons in a 7.3. that's pretty rediculous. wonder what i coulda done with a cummins for that same money. haha. i'm done with my rant now guys, sorry about that. LoL

[displacedtexan]

Numerous problems with your post...

The Cummins guys know Zach is working on a head. And not to knock him at all, but he's not the first. Several have been coming or in the works. None have actually happened.

And on the cost of parts and so many of them being billet, and more expensive than gasser parts. How many hot 5.0s are there? How many 7.3? If the parts are gonna sell in higher volume they can spread the R&D over more units. And many times it's cheaper to mill one off stuff than have it cast somewhere...

[KBennett]

It all comes down to what you want your truck to do. For me it has just been a couple mods to make a good reliable towing package that will pull my trailers with more power than I could ever need so I am good to go.

Take a step back and look at YOUR truck. Does it provide the power that you need? If not, give promodracer some areas where you would like to see improvements. This F vs D vs C stuff is getting old, especially when they all have their shortcomings.

[displacedtexan]

Promodracer has already been offered some ideas on a solid business plan.

If I had the next big idea for diesel performance, I sure wouldn't be giving it to a stranger on the interweb...

[promodracer]

Originally Posted by imelmo

He said 4.6, not 6.4.

.

darn dislexia

[promodracer]

Originally Posted by displacedtexan

Numerous problems with your post...

The Cummins guys know Zach is working on a head. And not to knock him at all, but he's not the first. Several have been coming or in the works. None have actually happened.

And on the cost of parts and so many of them being billet, and more expensive than gasser parts. How many hot 5.0s are there? How many 7.3? If the parts are gonna sell in higher volume they can spread the R&D over more units. And many times it's cheaper to mill one off stuff than have it cast somewhere...

He is dead on with this.
You can also control turn around time and reduce up front costs associated with molds for casting, irregularities in castings, and billet is much stronger.
It will matter when you have only four studs around each cylinder.

[strokin'_tatsch]

i haven't seen many people having an issue with a cast head being a problem other than the stock flow characteristics suck. only thing i don't like about billet stuff is its really expensive to the consumer and if thats what you want to sell then so be it. sure, billet is stronger and would make sweet heads, but you can also have cast iron cryo'd to strengthen it significantly as well. i understand that castings will have some irregularities and the billet would probably perform a bit better, but is it worth the cost? i personally would think the cost of billet heads would be too expensive for many people to buy. i priced a front cover and stuff to convert my 7.3 to mechanical injection and the price is crazy and probably mostly b/c of the billet cover, but again if that's how the company wants to do it or if cast just simply won't cut it then so be it, i just will never be able to afford said billet parts. haha.

I was just thinking if there was a cheaper way to build the parts and they still work fine then more people would buy them b/c the company could then sell those parts cheaper, but most diesel performance shops are small and i could see that they wouldn't have the tools to cast new stuff like they can CNC machine the parts. it was just a thought. haha. if someone made aftermarket heads for the 7.3 that i could afford i know i'd be on it asap b/c the stock 7.3 heads probably flow way worse than the 12v does. haha

[displacedtexan]

Don't you think if they could figure out a way to make it a little cheaper and sell more of it they would?

Custom stuff is expensive. Period. And aftermarket heads, front covers, etc for diesels are a very small market. They are basically custom parts.

[Dr Smoke]

If the heads worked well and were proven I would take 3-5 sets for projects we are working on right now.