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Old 02-17-2017, 11:29 PM   #21
mfsuper90
 
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Running a 4000 gallon poop tanker straight truck with bags is kinda sketchy. It rolls like no other going around turns. We ran dump valves to switches in the cab so when we spread on hillsides we can dump the upper side to help level it.

On big trucks, I prefer a solid setup over bags with something like that tanker. Bags roll in the turns a lot more than a leaf or block setup.

I know it's totally different than what your doing, but it's something to take into consideration
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Old 02-17-2017, 11:40 PM   #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mfsuper90 View Post
Running a 4000 gallon poop tanker straight truck with bags is kinda sketchy. It rolls like no other going around turns. We ran dump valves to switches in the cab so when we spread on hillsides we can dump the upper side to help level it.

On big trucks, I prefer a solid setup over bags with something like that tanker. Bags roll in the turns a lot more than a leaf or block setup.

I know it's totally different than what your doing, but it's something to take into consideration


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Old 02-18-2017, 12:10 AM   #23
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jfaulkner View Post
Wtf are you talking about? With a leveling valve it doesn't matter if your pulling a bumper pull trailer or the bed is full, the valve will fill the bags until the frame is at the pre-set height. Your "the weight is always in the center on the kingpin" doesn't apply to straight trucks (log trucks, vac trucks, stone slingers ect) and they use the same setup. I had this exact setup on my Dodge for years. Had a 12v compressor with a tank in place of the spare tire. Tank had a pressure switch that controlled the compressor. On class 8 stuff that is always heavy on one side they will put a leveling valve on each side but it is rare because simple is always better.

The reason pickup guys don't like it is because they LOVE to tinker. They don't like the fact they can load whatever they want and never touch anything and the truck rides level. They like to push buttons and read gauges. If you want the ability to dump the bags most leveling valves have a dump option. Simply send air to one port from a switch and it will dump.

A lot of Kelderman kits use them, guess you should call and let them know it doesn't work.
I never said anything about mechanical load leveling valves being bad. I mentioned using them. I mentioned controlling the bags individually because a 4-link is going to be able to roll much more than the 2-link on a big truck, since the axle isn't doubling as a sway bar as it is on the big rig. So whether he uses mechanical valves, electronic system or just manually fills them, individually supplied bags is going to be the best course to take.

I've got the Accu-air E-level in my truck (because I like shiny things and have to tinker). I like that its fully adjustable and use it frequently. Being that you are only going with half a suspension, the benefit would be too little for the price tag. The mechanical valves is what I'd run in that instance. You can get them with internal dump valves if you're so inclined.

What bags are you looking at running?
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Old 02-18-2017, 12:27 AM   #24
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Helluva first post, welcome, and good luck. I know nothing about airbags, but these other guys do.
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Old 02-18-2017, 12:51 AM   #25
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tate View Post
I never said anything about mechanical load leveling valves being bad. I mentioned using them. I mentioned controlling the bags individually because a 4-link is going to be able to roll much more than the 2-link on a big truck, since the axle isn't doubling as a sway bar as it is on the big rig. So whether he uses mechanical valves, electronic system or just manually fills them, individually supplied bags is going to be the best course to take.

I've got the Accu-air E-level in my truck (because I like shiny things and have to tinker). I like that its fully adjustable and use it frequently. Being that you are only going with half a suspension, the benefit would be too little for the price tag. The mechanical valves is what I'd run in that instance. You can get them with internal dump valves if you're so inclined.

What bags are you looking at running?
I'm gonna buy the Accuair system as well. After looking into it, it looks so much more simple than what I was gonna do. Plus having the controller in cab, with the electronic leveling sounds nice.

As Far as bags go, I was looking at the Firestone 3500# rolling sleeve bag
I've heard other people using it, and the only problem I've read is that its huge. It's mostly the weight that it can hold that is why I'm looking at it. Idk if you have any suggestions for bags that can hold that kind of weight?
f2107__31659.1442517678.1280.1280.jpg
 
Old 02-18-2017, 12:57 AM   #26
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mfsuper90 View Post
Running a 4000 gallon poop tanker straight truck with bags is kinda sketchy. It rolls like no other going around turns. We ran dump valves to switches in the cab so when we spread on hillsides we can dump the upper side to help level it.

On big trucks, I prefer a solid setup over bags with something like that tanker. Bags roll in the turns a lot more than a leaf or block setup.

I know it's totally different than what your doing, but it's something to take into consideration
I used to drive trucks and we had a dump truck with full air ride, it used to be a truck with a 5th wheel that we converted to a dump truck... and yeah I totally understand what your saying, that thing would rock like a boat when it was loaded... also when you get going down the road it takes a min for the bags to level out and you get to rocking back and forth (like body roll back and forth) like your on a boat. I'm HOPING that my setup doesn't end up like that. but If it does, I will figure out how to fix it.
 
Old 02-18-2017, 03:31 AM   #27
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tate View Post
I never said anything about mechanical load leveling valves being bad. I mentioned using them. I mentioned controlling the bags individually because a 4-link is going to be able to roll much more than the 2-link on a big truck, since the axle isn't doubling as a sway bar as it is on the big rig. So whether he uses mechanical valves, electronic system or just manually fills them, individually supplied bags is going to be the best course to take.

I've got the Accu-air E-level in my truck (because I like shiny things and have to tinker). I like that its fully adjustable and use it frequently. Being that you are only going with half a suspension, the benefit would be too little for the price tag. The mechanical valves is what I'd run in that instance. You can get them with internal dump valves if you're so inclined.

What bags are you looking at running?
i havent seen a class 8 suspension that doesn't have top roll bars since the early 70s, there are no true two link setups on any truck that is on the road these days.

Don't buy into the fuel tank offsetting weight, we have one truck that only runs a single 150 and doesn't have any issues like mentioned.
 
Old 02-18-2017, 08:19 AM   #28
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Originally Posted by biggy238 View Post
I would isolate the bags from one another or run a beefy sway bar. If you don't, just filling the fuel tank will cause body roll.

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Are you serous? Must be a HUGE tank because this truck is bagged, no sway bars and rides like a dream. Way more weight 10' in the air than a fuel tank on a pickup.

Click the image to open in full size.
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Old 02-18-2017, 02:07 PM   #29
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mccoywelding View Post
I'm gonna buy the Accuair system as well. After looking into it, it looks so much more simple than what I was gonna do. Plus having the controller in cab, with the electronic leveling sounds nice.

As Far as bags go, I was looking at the Firestone 3500# rolling sleeve bag
I've heard other people using it, and the only problem I've read is that its huge. It's mostly the weight that it can hold that is why I'm looking at it. Idk if you have any suggestions for bags that can hold that kind of weight?
Attachment 65908
There are lots of Firestone bags that will support that weight. What you need to figure out is which ones, as they come in different lengths, which changes the spring rates in them. Also if you want internal bumpstops.

Reversible Sleeve Air Spring for Commercial Trucks and Trialer | TruckSpring

http://firestoneip.com/-/media/www/g...alogs/EMDG.pdf
http://rsleafspring.com/%5Cresources...ment_Guide.pdf

Couple resources for helping you find bags. The first link, on many of their bags, has a link to the Firestone data sheet.

4-Link and Air Ride - Competition Diesel.Com - Bringing The BEST Together
The link to my build. Has the bags I used and their data sheets.


Quote:
Originally Posted by SmokinCAT View Post
i havent seen a class 8 suspension that doesn't have top roll bars since the early 70s, there are no true two link setups on any truck that is on the road these days.
I feel like we are starting to split hairs. Most people exclude the panhard bar when talking about the number of links. I guess in that respect, mine is a 5-link, as is every front end in Pre-2013 Dodges. Panhard or no panhard, the suspension in a big rig is still articulation limited which means body roll and weight distribution is much less of a factor when the bags are tied together side to side. That was the entirety of my point.
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Old 02-18-2017, 02:48 PM   #30
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I have both on the same suspension, single valve with all bags tied together and dual with each side separated. There is no noticeable difference In how they handle.
 
Old 02-18-2017, 03:28 PM   #31
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5 gal tank will be plenty.. there's a 5gallon and a vise 450IG single compressor 12v.. compressor runs maybe 25% loaded.. full deflated to full Inflated loaded kicks the AC on runs a 90/125 on/of switch
Has 4 5900lb bags on it
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Old 02-18-2017, 03:29 PM   #32
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SmokinCAT View Post
I have both on the same suspension, single valve with all bags tied together and dual with each side separated. There is no noticeable difference In how they handle.


Is that full of fuel or empty?
 
Old 02-19-2017, 11:16 AM   #33
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mccoywelding View Post
I'm gonna buy the Accuair system as well. After looking into it, it looks so much more simple than what I was gonna do. Plus having the controller in cab, with the electronic leveling sounds nice.

As Far as bags go, I was looking at the Firestone 3500# rolling sleeve bag
I've heard other people using it, and the only problem I've read is that its huge. It's mostly the weight that it can hold that is why I'm looking at it. Idk if you have any suggestions for bags that can hold that kind of weight?
Attachment 65908
Look for Firestone F2107 I think it was. It's a nicely sized rolling sleeve.



Sent from my XT1575 using Tapatalk
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Old 02-19-2017, 11:24 AM   #34
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Listen people, we aren't talking about a mid or heavy duty truck.

If it's done right, it won't have any trouble. If it's done wrong, the body will roll because of small insignificant things.

I wouldn't mention the thing about the roll if I hadn't seen it happen. It's not any different than the conversation about why people don't like dumps to have bags. If the proper equipment is in place, it's fine. If not, the air system will have to compensate.





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Old 02-19-2017, 11:46 AM   #35
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tate View Post
There are lots of Firestone bags that will support that weight. What you need to figure out is which ones, as they come in different lengths, which changes the spring rates in them. Also if you want internal bumpstops.

Reversible Sleeve Air Spring for Commercial Trucks and Trialer | TruckSpring

http://firestoneip.com/-/media/www/g...alogs/EMDG.pdf
http://rsleafspring.com/%5Cresources...ment_Guide.pdf

Couple resources for helping you find bags. The first link, on many of their bags, has a link to the Firestone data sheet.

4-Link and Air Ride - Competition Diesel.Com - Bringing The BEST Together
The link to my build. Has the bags I used and their data sheets.




I feel like we are starting to split hairs. Most people exclude the panhard bar when talking about the number of links. I guess in that respect, mine is a 5-link, as is every front end in Pre-2013 Dodges. Panhard or no panhard, the suspension in a big rig is still articulation limited which means body roll and weight distribution is much less of a factor when the bags are tied together side to side. That was the entirety of my point.
I didn't see this. Spot on.

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Old 02-19-2017, 11:47 AM   #36
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Click the image to open in full size.

Just saying...

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Old 02-19-2017, 07:37 PM   #37
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Originally Posted by biggy238 View Post
Listen people, we aren't talking about a mid or heavy duty truck.

If it's done right, it won't have any trouble. If it's done wrong, the body will roll because of small insignificant things.

I wouldn't mention the thing about the roll if I hadn't seen it happen. It's not any different than the conversation about why people don't like dumps to have bags. If the proper equipment is in place, it's fine. If not, the air system will have to compensate.





Sent from my XT1575 using Tapatalk


I want a roll of the 1/4" air line the pickup guys use that flow from bag to bag so fast it makes the truck roll on curves. Fire trucks could use it instead of that big junk they keep buying.
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Old 02-19-2017, 07:46 PM   #38
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No one said anything about curves but you. 😉

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Old 02-20-2017, 09:47 PM   #39
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Originally Posted by oldestof11 View Post
Click the image to open in full size.

Just saying...

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I had a few allroads (the exact car in that diagram) and they rode so nicely. No excessive body roll, the compressor did not kick on compulsively, and had a small-ish tank (approx 2g). The sway bars were not very big, and it was over 4000#. The key was in the programming, it needed to see out of tolerance ride height for more than xxxx time before it compensated that bag.


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Old 02-20-2017, 09:52 PM   #40
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I had a few allroads (the exact car in that diagram) and they rode so nicely. No excessive body roll, the compressor did not kick on compulsively, and had a small-ish tank (approx 2g). The sway bars were not very big, and it was over 4000#. The key was in the programming, it needed to see out of tolerance ride height for more than xxxx time before it compensated that bag.


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But remember what it was designed for, off and on road performance. Meant to articulate but not roll. Maintain height and composure.

But just goes to show a couple valves are not going to work with something.meant to articulate.

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