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Old 06-05-2017, 09:26 PM   #21
BC847
 
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The now removed engine lube-oil pump appears to be in good working order.

Gonna have to heed Snedge's suggestion to look into an alternate gasket for between the remote filter cover-plate and oil cooler.

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Old 06-06-2017, 11:41 AM   #22
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My first thoughts were similar to what Will said about comparing the cover plate to the oil filter head to see if the passages are any different.

You've probably compared the gaskets and part numbers or Jeff's done so already but I attached a screen shot from QuickServe for my engine. The gaskets appear to be the same based on the images.

Is there anything inside or behind the supply port in the cover plate that would prevent feed to the turbo(s)? I imagine it's not a blind hole that requires drilling and tapping. Surely you'd have caught that. Still strange that the gauge registers pressure when cranking but not running.

Click the image to open in full size.

Click the image to open in full size.
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File Type: jpg oil cooler package.jpg (284.7 KB, 0 views)
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Old 06-06-2017, 11:58 AM   #23
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Just to compare the passages. These pictures show it is bored through.

Cover (filter relocation) plate.
Click the image to open in full size.

Oil filter head.
Click the image to open in full size.
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Old 06-06-2017, 12:16 PM   #24
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Competition Diesel.Com - Bringing The BEST Together - View Single Post - oil filter relocation: pictures...
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Old 06-06-2017, 01:18 PM   #25
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Drasko View Post
Try shimming the spring on the regulator. Im betting its opening up. Also put a mechanical gauge on so you can see if this helps.
Referencing part numbers between the cover plate and filter head, the pressure regulator spring returns the same number but others show as well.
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Last edited by jimbo486; 06-06-2017 at 01:27 PM.
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Old 06-06-2017, 01:30 PM   #26
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Sorry for so many posts but I'm racking my brain and thinking outloud. Looking at pictures of my engine, the supply and return ports in the block don't appear to align well with the cover plate passages. Maybe it's just my eyes.

Click the image to open in full size.

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Old 06-06-2017, 02:19 PM   #27
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Why is the system relief valve not installed In the photo you posted?

Also, is part 11 not backwards in the quickserve photo?

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Click the image to open in full size.
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Last edited by biggy238; 06-06-2017 at 02:22 PM.
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Old 06-06-2017, 02:41 PM   #28
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Are you still using the factory oil cooler in the block?
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Old 06-06-2017, 04:43 PM   #29
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Folks, I appreciate y'all thinking about this with me.

jimbo486, I suppose you've found as I, there's not a lot of info out there about this filter relocation plate.

biggy238, Yes, the oil pressure regulator piston is shown backwards as hell in the Cummins photo. That pic of the filter relocation plate is shown minus the oil pressure regulator. It's purchased separately.

I found an article about the Cummins engine written by Roy Berndt that sheds some light on the oil system and coolers. It includes:

Quote:
Covers and Coolers
The B series engine could experience high oil pressure spikes on cold start up (up to 130 PSI), especially in low ambient temperatures. The original design would take oil bypassed by the oil pressure regulator and route it to the oil pump inlet (dump to pump). To correct this, use an oil cooler, oil cooler cover and oil cooler gasket that takes the oil bypassed by the regulator and routes it into the oil pan (dump to sump).

Click the image to open in full size.
Oil coolers and gaskets can give you fits if used in the wrong combination, with either extremely high or low oil pressure, when used in the incorrect combinations.

Cooler #1 is used as follows: Coolers with four-passage drillings have drillings at both the dump-to-sump and dump-to-pump locations. These are not to be used on the ISB (STORM) blocks and are no longer produced for production or service.

Cooler #2 is used as follows: Coolers with three-passage drillings designed for dump-to-sump lubricating systems can be used in a STORM or pre-STORM block if the engine uses a dump-to-sump oil system.

Cooler #3 is used as follows: Coolers with 3-passage drillings designed for dump-to-pump lubricating systems can only be used on STORM or pre-STORM blocks with a dump-to-pump oil system.

Gasket #1 is for a STORM Block and can be easily identified by the “window” and slot in it.

Gasket #2 is for a Pre-STORM Block. The cylinder block, oil cooler, oil cooler gasket and oil cooler cover must be matched up correctly. If not done correctly, high oil pressure or low oil pressure will be experienced.



In talking with Snedge, I should be using that gasket shown as A (from a STORM block).


I've still got to pull the turbos so as to get to the thing and compare the storm gasket to the OEM (B) gasket. The STORM gasket should be here by Friday. (I hope).
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Silencer ring MIA, str8 pipe with 10" exhaust tip, 250psi boost gauge, ghost-lights 'n truck-nutz. K&N air filter next (if my grades are good enoufh).

Last edited by BC847; 06-06-2017 at 04:48 PM.
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Old 06-06-2017, 04:44 PM   #30
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Drasko View Post
Are you still using the factory oil cooler in the block?
Yes. That shown as cooler #2. In the stock/OEM form, that cooler works in my heap with gasket B.
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Last edited by BC847; 06-06-2017 at 04:49 PM.
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Old 06-07-2017, 11:18 AM   #31
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Not to derail, but whose triple kit is that? And what turbos??


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Old 06-07-2017, 12:58 PM   #32
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I've been keeping up with BC's sweet tripe build on 1stgen.org. He built it himself and they are 62mm borg sxe's I believe. I can never get logged in over there for some reason but I have been checking on his progress daily for a long time. Sweet as hell I think and can't wait to see how 'ol mean green runs once he gets it all buttoned up!
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Old 06-07-2017, 03:28 PM   #33
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That's a super clean setup for being home brewed. I'm impressed.


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Old 06-08-2017, 03:57 PM   #34
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Folks, thanks for the kind words over my mess. Let me get it all running before I post anything about it. Ain't no count if it don't run.

I got the STORM block gasket in my hands. My Son's on his way over so as to help me lift the spinny-things out of the way.

We'll see.
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Silencer ring MIA, str8 pipe with 10" exhaust tip, 250psi boost gauge, ghost-lights 'n truck-nutz. K&N air filter next (if my grades are good enoufh).
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Old 06-08-2017, 06:38 PM   #35
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mooner1 View Post
I've been keeping up with BC's sweet tripe build on 1stgen.org. He built it himself and they are 62mm borg sxe's I believe. I can never get logged in over there for some reason but I have been checking on his progress daily for a long time. Sweet as hell I think and can't wait to see how 'ol mean green runs once he gets it all buttoned up!
Link? I love triple builds lol.

Hope you figure out the oil issue. Cant wait to see how it runs.
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Old 06-08-2017, 09:30 PM   #36
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Angry

Quote:
Originally Posted by BC847 View Post
. . . it'll be something stupid (that I've done no doubt), . . .
Click the image to open in full size.
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Old 06-08-2017, 09:57 PM   #37
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BC847 View Post
Click the image to open in full size.
It happens. Keep going forward!
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Old 06-08-2017, 10:51 PM   #38
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When I fabricated and installed the remote engine lube-oil filter bracket and filter-head, I bet I spent a good cumulative hour studying the filter lines exclusively. Confirming the Asian fella's idea of the English In/Out and which port to cast them to. Ciphering the proper dirty oil in, and clean oil out of the filter-head. All that and more is required to build a working thing. The top idea in all of this was to have the chit work and be reliable. I'm use to beating the snot out of my heap on a Thursday night, only to drive it to the coast and back the following weekend. Been doing THAT thing with a HT3B blowing into an S362 for fiveish years.

I guess there's folks out there who would have thought the gauge was wrong and drove it to disaster . . . . . . Click the image to open in full size.


Anyhoo . . . .


Y'all took the time to mess with me and my heap, let me return the favor . . .

My 1993 Cummins 12v block is of the "Dump to Sump" in terms of where the oil pressure regulator dumps that excess oil pressure it vents. It dumps it to the sump (oil pan). There apparently are blocks out there that "Dump to Pump" and might have issues with substantial oil pressure spikes as a result. That's why there's two or three gaskets for the 12v application of stuff. Don't quote me there as the dump to pump didn't pertain to me so . . .


Anyway, the illustration of parts for MY heap is in fact correct as show here.
Click the image to open in full size.



My 1993 stock/OEM cooler-cover gasket works with this remote filter cooler-cover.

This is the block-side of the remote-filter cooler-cover:

Click the image to open in full size.



My 1993 cover to cooler gasket fits all ports involved as shown:
(Blue is oil flow direction)
Click the image to open in full size.



The foot-prints of the remote-filter cooler-cover passages are clearly seen and present where they should:

Click the image to open in full size.



The STORM/Encore whatever block gasket does not work on my 1993 12v block. The gasket's extra port makes a leak in the seal of the clean/cooled oil supply to the engine passage. As such, it will dump clean/cooled oil to the regulator's drain to the pan.

Click the image to open in full size.


I'll round up and post the part numbers that work on my heap in a short while.








Phacking oil filter's anti-drainback valve made the weird oil pressure/flow stuff.
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Silencer ring MIA, str8 pipe with 10" exhaust tip, 250psi boost gauge, ghost-lights 'n truck-nutz. K&N air filter next (if my grades are good enoufh).

Last edited by BC847; 06-08-2017 at 10:55 PM.
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Old 06-08-2017, 11:34 PM   #39
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So it's fixed?


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Old 06-09-2017, 12:28 AM   #40
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I knew it was your problem, I honestly didn't have the pictures to back up the problem, thank you for taking the time to post pictures to help others who follow in your foot steps. The only other thing I'll mention is if you use the early style gasket that does not have the cut out, it will hold pressure, but it scares me to have oil pushing against the gasket that is unsupported on the backside, so we drill, tap, and plug that small hole (return to pump) on storm blocks when using the early style cooler/filter head.

The only way to learn about this problem is to make the mistake, scratch your head for a day or two, and then dig in and follow the oil flow passages from oil pickup tube to main oil galleys in the block.

Glad you found your problem. I was a bit worried about your slow crank oil pressure, that one stumped me so I wasn't too assertive about the cooler/filter head/gasket differences, but the filter internal bypass makes sense, so I learned something from this as well.

Once again, thanks for posting pictures and fairly detailed explanation of the oil flow, I'll bet it helps out many more "hotrodders" in the future.
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