Advertisement |
|
|
|
If this is your first visit, be sure to check out the FAQ by clicking the link above.
You may have to register before you can post: click the register link above to proceed.
To start viewing messages, select the forum that you want to visit from the selection below.
|
6.0 Powerstroke Discussion of the 03-06 6.0 |
07-06-2009, 08:53 AM
|
#41
|
Name: BC06PSD
Title: Hairless Cat Aficionado
Status: Not Here
Join Date: May 2006
Member`s Gallery
Posts: 848
|
Quote:
Originally Posted by PSDPlayer
Dollar cost benefit over proper maintenance of filters and Just drilling out a factory banjo bolt?
|
Maybe I missed it somewhere in the thread, but whats the answer. I don't have a few hundred dollars to burn on an uneeded mod.
__________________
06 F-250 6.0 PSD CC
GoGo Race
S&B
MBRP
Quad Commander
|
|
|
07-06-2009, 09:42 AM
|
#42
|
Name: Trusted
Title: Too Much Time
Status: Not Here
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Texas
Member`s Gallery
Posts: 761
|
So, you are comfortable telling people to use the factory fuel lines (.172” according to your measurement) with almost any size injector?
I find it interesting that the fuel plunger inside of the injector is substantially larger than that the factory fuel line feeding them and you don’t feel a need to increase the supply line. The injector plunger is almost twice the size of the factory fuel line, I’m sorry is twice the size of the fuel line, which means the demand is potentially greater than the supply. That just doesn’t seem to be a good design in my book.
|
|
|
07-06-2009, 10:01 AM
|
#43
|
Name: Abrannan19
Title: NOBAMA 09-12
Status: Not Here
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Jacksonville,FL
Member`s Gallery
Posts: 3,034
|
Quote:
Originally Posted by Trusted
So, you are comfortable telling people to use the factory fuel lines (.172” according to your measurement) with almost any size injector?
|
you feel comfortable telling people they can run up to 190's on a stock fuel pump safely?
|
|
|
07-06-2009, 10:02 AM
|
#44
|
Name: PSDPlayer
Title: Captain Negativity!
Status: Not Here
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: Ft. Lauderdale, FL
Member`s Gallery
Posts: 3,284
|
Yeah. Once you remove the .020 orifice in the banjo bolt. .172" should feed a ton of fuel to the injector. .172 is 8.6 times larger than .020. What is that in percent? .040 would be 100% right? .080 would be 400%. .160 (DJ fitting would be 800%) And if the stock line is larger than that.... Golly gee. What could I ever do with that much fuel flow.
__________________
05 CC LB DRW Lariat 4x2 Dropped 3/6.
|
|
|
07-06-2009, 10:08 AM
|
#45
|
Name: Trusted
Title: Too Much Time
Status: Not Here
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Texas
Member`s Gallery
Posts: 761
|
Quote:
Originally Posted by PSDPlayer
Yeah. Once you remove the .020 orifice in the banjo bolt. .172" should feed a ton of fuel to the injector. .172 is 8.6 times larger than .020. What is that in percent? .040 would be 100% right? .080 would be 400%. .160 (DJ fitting would be 800%) And if the stock line is larger than that.... Golly gee. What could I ever do with that much fuel flow.
|
The plunger itself it 200% larger than the factory fuel line, which by your own measurement is bigger than DJ's.
I'm personally not comfortable trying to feed the injectors that are 200 + dollar a piece with a fuel line that is smaller than the plunger.
You can do it, that's fine. On your race motors, make sure that you only run a .172" line and not the 3/8 you have on there now.
|
|
|
07-06-2009, 10:19 AM
|
#46
|
Name: PSDPlayer
Title: Captain Negativity!
Status: Not Here
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: Ft. Lauderdale, FL
Member`s Gallery
Posts: 3,284
|
Quote:
Originally Posted by Trusted
The plunger itself it 200% larger than the factory fuel line, which by your own measurement is bigger than DJ's.
I'm personally not comfortable trying to feed the injectors that are 200 + dollar a piece with a fuel line that is smaller than the plunger.
You can do it, that's fine. On your race motors, make sure that you only run a .172" line and not the 3/8 you have on there now.
|
How much more do your lines flow when the customer doesn't change their fuel filters?
The plunger in the injector is that size to create the ratio to get the injection pressure up to 7.1 times over the high pressure system. So if the plunger diameter is .172 times 2. I'll be just fine at 50psi through .172 inches feeding the cavity in the head.
__________________
05 CC LB DRW Lariat 4x2 Dropped 3/6.
|
|
|
07-06-2009, 10:26 AM
|
#47
|
Name: Trusted
Title: Too Much Time
Status: Not Here
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Texas
Member`s Gallery
Posts: 761
|
Quote:
Originally Posted by Abrannan19
you feel comfortable telling people they can run up to 190's on a stock fuel pump safely?
|
If you go back is said"
The factory fuel pump can support injectors up to around 190cc's. If you plan on upgrading your injectors, it is strongly recommended that you have a fuel pressure gauge to monitor the fuel pressure. (Keep in mind that not all injectors flow the same. So, two different companies 190’s may actually flow quite a bit different.)
If you are seeing the pressure drop, then upgrading your fuel pump is recommended.
"
Key words/points:
Around 190cc
strongly recommended that you have a fuel pressure gauge
Not all injectors flow the same
if you are seeing the pressure drop, upgrade your fuel pump
Even in your follow up question
Quote:
Originally Posted by Abrannan19
seriously?!?! maybe some II 190's but elite,cass or RCD I HIGHLY doubt.
|
You say that II’s injectors may work with a factory fuel pump. So, by that, follow up question, you are agreeing with the above statement that there may be possibilities of the factory fuel pump supporting larger injectors.
So, to answer your question:
Yes I feel comfortable telling people they can run up to 190's on a stock fuel pump safely if they have a gauge to monitor their fuel pressure.
Would it be better to run a FASS or AirDog, probably. Is that a bad idea, no. Do they have to, not necessarly it all depends on their fuel pressure. Realize that by upgrading the fuel pump and not the lines, 60 psi from a factory fuel pump is the same as 60 psi out of an AirDog or FASS. You could argue the air separation but that’s another issue that we are not discussing. Do I recommend our fuel pump/system, NO. Especially not with only 190’s.
|
|
|
07-06-2009, 10:27 AM
|
#48
|
Name: Trusted
Title: Too Much Time
Status: Not Here
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Texas
Member`s Gallery
Posts: 761
|
Quote:
Originally Posted by PSDPlayer
How much more do your lines flow when the customer doesn't change their fuel filters?
|
none
|
|
|
07-06-2009, 10:32 AM
|
#49
|
Name: PSDPlayer
Title: Captain Negativity!
Status: Not Here
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: Ft. Lauderdale, FL
Member`s Gallery
Posts: 3,284
|
So.... If im pumping potentialy 67 liters per hour at 60psi through the factory pump. And then I put a pump capable of 180 gallons per hour... It is possible to move more of something at the same pressure?
__________________
05 CC LB DRW Lariat 4x2 Dropped 3/6.
|
|
|
07-06-2009, 10:36 AM
|
#50
|
Name: Abrannan19
Title: NOBAMA 09-12
Status: Not Here
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Jacksonville,FL
Member`s Gallery
Posts: 3,034
|
I was merely pointing out that II sticks are small and flow very little compared to others
But, then you posted up that the stock lines aren't sufficient for stock injectors and you didn't want to risk $200 injectors
Quote:
Originally Posted by Trusted
I'm personally not comfortable trying to feed the injectors that are 200 + dollar a piece with a fuel line that is smaller than the plunger.
|
But when the warranty speculates on the aftermarket injectors " Severe injector plunger and barrel scoring due to prolonged fuel pressure loss not warrantable."
I would be adding a fass/airdog long before changing fuel lines.
BTW I would really like to see some WOT throttle runs with your 185's and the stock fuel pump, can you post up some videos of the fuel pressure gauges during this?
|
|
|
07-06-2009, 10:41 AM
|
#51
|
Name: PSDPlayer
Title: Captain Negativity!
Status: Not Here
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: Ft. Lauderdale, FL
Member`s Gallery
Posts: 3,284
|
The number 1 cause of fuel pressure issues is from customers not changing their fuel filters. I think thats why Ford even puts an FF on the original filter. Factory Filter not being changed means you are your own cause of failure. I would hate to see someone spend money on all the "upgraded" lines and have more failures cause they can now not afford the next several fuel filter changes.
__________________
05 CC LB DRW Lariat 4x2 Dropped 3/6.
|
|
|
07-06-2009, 10:48 AM
|
#52
|
Name: Abrannan19
Title: NOBAMA 09-12
Status: Not Here
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Jacksonville,FL
Member`s Gallery
Posts: 3,034
|
so its not rotella oil WTF?!?!
|
|
|
07-06-2009, 10:49 AM
|
#53
|
Name: PSDPlayer
Title: Captain Negativity!
Status: Not Here
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: Ft. Lauderdale, FL
Member`s Gallery
Posts: 3,284
|
Quote:
Originally Posted by Abrannan19
so its not rotella oil WTF?!?!
|
No. That's the second leading cause.
__________________
05 CC LB DRW Lariat 4x2 Dropped 3/6.
|
|
|
07-06-2009, 11:04 AM
|
#54
|
Name: agamache
Title: Green Behind the Ears
Status: Not Here
Join Date: May 2009
Location: MT.VERNON,IN
Member`s Gallery
Posts: 97
|
With stock inj and pump if u show 60psi @ idle and wot. With factory lines also.
Then put bigger lines on it u would show 60psi @ idle and maybe only 50psi @ wot. But have the same flow of fuel. Correct?
__________________
2004 F250 4X4
EDGE J/A
MBRP 4" TURBO BACK EXHAUST
COOLANT FILTRATION SYSTEM
SOLD
Now Have:
2005 GMC/Duramax
CC, 4x4
Stock
|
|
|
07-06-2009, 11:08 AM
|
#55
|
Name: Extended Power
Title: Too Much Time
Status: Not Here
Join Date: May 2006
Member`s Gallery
Posts: 2,978
|
Quote:
Originally Posted by PSDPlayer
So.... If im pumping potentialy 67 liters per hour at 60psi through the factory pump. And then I put a pump capable of 180 gallons per hour... It is possible to move more of something at the same pressure?
|
67 liter per hour???
67 liters per hour = 17.7 US gal. or 14.7 Imp. gal.
Yes, If you have a pump that can move 180 gallons per hour at 60 psi, it will move more than a pump that is only capable of flowing 67 gallons per hour.
That's why you increase the line size...
60 Psi flow through a 1/4" line isn't even close to the flow through a 1/2" line at 60 psi...
__________________
2003 Ford KingRanch F-350 4x4
793HP fuel only
12.2 @ 113.06mph
If It Ain't Broke...Fix It Until It Is!!!
|
|
|
07-06-2009, 11:48 AM
|
#56
|
Name: PSDPlayer
Title: Captain Negativity!
Status: Not Here
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: Ft. Lauderdale, FL
Member`s Gallery
Posts: 3,284
|
So If I were to tell you that the stock pump. Pumps say 67 liters per hour. Would you tell me I am a liar? Hell I'll even spot you say up to 90 liters per hour.
__________________
05 CC LB DRW Lariat 4x2 Dropped 3/6.
|
|
|
07-06-2009, 11:54 AM
|
#57
|
Name: Dalpilot
Title: Joe Nobody!
Status: Not Here
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: Austin, Texas
Member`s Gallery
Posts: 11,373
|
Keep it nice, and keep me out of it.
__________________
2017 White f-250 COMPETITIONDIESEL.COM Bringing the best together
|
|
|
07-06-2009, 11:55 AM
|
#58
|
Name: TANKS 250
Title: Hey guys...look at me..
Status: Not Here
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Belle Chasse, LA
Member`s Gallery
Posts: 7,052
|
So......
So......
So.....
so....what you are saying is,...
so....what you mean is...
There is alot of "so's" being thrown around..
Sew buttons on your underware...
.
__________________
2005 F-250, CC,SB,PSD, MANUAL TRANNY
Icon 4.5" lift, 41" IROKS, and some other stuff
Special thanks to:
TrustedPerformance.com
KLMperformance.com
Black Ops Bumpers
FarmboyFabrications.com
|
|
|
07-06-2009, 12:13 PM
|
#59
|
Name: Extended Power
Title: Too Much Time
Status: Not Here
Join Date: May 2006
Member`s Gallery
Posts: 2,978
|
Quote:
Originally Posted by PSDPlayer
So If I were to tell you that the stock pump. Pumps say 67 liters per hour. Would you tell me I am a liar? Hell I'll even spot you say up to 90 liters per hour.
|
I don't care what you tell me the stock pump puts out.
I know that you are just being you....again.
I changed from a stock pump, to an Aeromotive marine grade set-up, to a FASS 150/180, then back to the Aeromotive set-up with more changes.
I would rather have too much fuel volume, and constant pressure then not enough of either one....but hey....that's me.
You put whatever you want on your truck, and I'll put whatever I want on my truck.
If people are happy with stock....leave it alone then.
Next you might say something like: "There's no reason to go with aftermarket rims, cuz the stock ones work just as good ...."
__________________
2003 Ford KingRanch F-350 4x4
793HP fuel only
12.2 @ 113.06mph
If It Ain't Broke...Fix It Until It Is!!!
|
|
|
07-06-2009, 01:23 PM
|
#60
|
Name: PSDPlayer
Title: Captain Negativity!
Status: Not Here
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: Ft. Lauderdale, FL
Member`s Gallery
Posts: 3,284
|
I like spending money on an improvement. I have aftermarket rims and tires. I just didn't understand why someone was driven to change something when the new thing was a step backwards. Me being me must be a bad thing. But if I helped someone save hundreds of dollars then I'm happy. But the stock pump does pump that amount of fuel. I'll be the first to admit that I don't sugar coat things. And it's amusing that you are lumping a fuel kit into something asthetic like wheels and tires instead of a performance Improvement like a turbocharger or stroker kit.
__________________
05 CC LB DRW Lariat 4x2 Dropped 3/6.
|
|
|
Posting Rules
|
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts
HTML code is Off
|
|
|
All times are GMT -5. The time now is 10:26 AM.
|