2009 F350 6.4 to 5.9 Cummins

[Roadblock]

Hello all.

I have a 2009 F350 with 410,000 km. I can't trace my small degas bottle bubbling (suspect head gasket), oil cooler is getting plugged (delta is around 10-11 degrees), and my blowby is slowly increasing.

Looking ahead I want to keep the truck but I can see many $$ in my future. I'm planning on driving it until it fails and doing a cummins swap. I've been reading a ton and know most of my options from 12V to 6.7.

My goal is to do a swap and get as close to the power I have now. With the kits out today it seems I can swap any of the Cummins engines and at around the same cost for the kit give or take. I need to understand if I'm better off getting a 12V and adding HP and torque or just going 24V or 6.7.

Please offer your opinions.

[bateman]

Couple fellas here that have experience with this.

12v vs commonrail is simple if you ask me. Do you have commonrail money or not? If yes, then go commonrail. I love my 12 valve, but the only instance it will outshine a CR Is by being affordable to poor folks ha.

[Phooker]

Grab an 06-07 5.9 with a cm849 ecm and harness. As much as a I love a 12 valve, you're used to common rail manners with the 6.4 and won't really be happy with a 500hp 12 valve.

[56cummins]

Originally Posted by bateman

Couple fellas here that have experience with this.

12v vs commonrail is simple if you ask me. Do you have commonrail money or not? If yes, then go commonrail. I love my 12 valve, but the only instance it will outshine a CR Is by being affordable to poor folks ha.

Thats about right.

OP, do you like old, really old tractors and all the noise and chooch they put out? If so build a 12v.

I passed up an 04 6speed dodge with a bad ecm. That particular ecm was pretty rare. I like being able to start my 12v with a screwdriver and bailing wire.

[Phooker]

The other question to ask, have you ever daily driven a 12 valve, if not, don't swap in a 12 valve.

[biggy238]

Originally Posted by Phooker

The other question to ask, have you ever daily driven a 12 valve, if not, don't swap in a 12 valve.

Hater

I find it ironic that a good deal of the CR tuning removes the actual tuning and reduces the file to 12 capabilities

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[biggy238]

OP, budget, HP goal, climate and downtime would be the factors I would consider.

I personally wouldn't want to mess with putting a throttle cable in a 6.4 truck.

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[Phooker]

Originally Posted by biggy238

Hater

I find it ironic that a good deal of the CR tuning removes the actual tuning and reduces the file to 12 capabilities

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It's not hating if I daily drove a twelve valve. It takes all kinds to make the world go round. Just minding my own business, it makes a weird noise, turn the radio down, increase throttle, decrease throttle, nothing blows up, turn radio back up and realize you've gained a new noise the truck makes.

Originally Posted by biggy238

OP, budget, HP goal, climate and downtime would be the factors I would consider.

I personally wouldn't want to mess with putting a throttle cable in a 6.4 truck.

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Budget and hp goal are the main questions. Considering it's a 6.4, I'd assume around 500hp, that's why I say grab a 06-07 5.9.

[Roadblock]

It's easier to respond at once than answer all individually. I was already leaning towards a 24V CR, but wanted to ask people with experience. I have rebuilt several SBC motors, TH350 and 700R4 transmissions. I am also a ticketed welder with the CWB, AWS, and ASME. I have fixed many vehicles for many problems and am the family "go to guy" for repairs. I know my way around a wrench.

The swap doesn't bother me and having to fabricate brackets on the fly doesn't either. I intend to grab a motor with harness, ECU, and downpipe to adapt to the 6.4 exhaust. Not including the engine and associated freshening costs, my budget would be $10000 USD for swap parts and necessary upgrades.

As far as the engine running like a tractor I want to avoid rolling coal as much as possible.

I am hoping for 500 HP and around 700 Ft Lbs torque.

[Phooker]

Originally Posted by Roadblock

It's easier to respond at once than answer all individually. I was already leaning towards a 24V CR, but wanted to ask people with experience. I have rebuilt several SBC motors, TH350 and 700R4 transmissions. I am also a ticketed welder with the CWB, AWS, and ASME. I have fixed many vehicles for many problems and am the family "go to guy" for repairs. I know my way around a wrench.

The swap doesn't bother me and having to fabricate brackets on the fly doesn't either. I intend to grab a motor with harness, ECU, and downpipe to adapt to the 6.4 exhaust. Not including the engine and associated freshening costs, my budget would be $10000 USD for swap parts and necessary upgrades.

As far as the engine running like a tractor I want to avoid rolling coal as much as possible.

I am hoping for 500 HP and around 700 Ft Lbs torque.

With that said, I'd look for an 06-07 5.9. They'll do right at 500 with a simple csp5 tune file. I'd also look at doing a little lower stall torque converter if you're keeping the 5r110, as the cummins makes torque several hundred rpm lower than the 6 4.

[Roadblock]

Originally Posted by Phooker

With that said, I'd look for an 06-07 5.9. They'll do right at 500 with a simple csp5 tune file. I'd also look at doing a little lower stall torque converter if you're keeping the 5r110, as the cummins makes torque several hundred rpm lower than the 6 4.

So, on the heels of your comment about the tune file I am a bit foggy. Does the swap keep both ECM's? 1 for the Ford CANBUS to not freak out and the other to manage the 5.9?

[Phooker]

Originally Posted by Roadblock

So, on the heels of your comment about the tune file I am a bit foggy. Does the swap keep both ECM's? 1 for the Ford CANBUS to not freak out and the other to manage the 5.9?

Yes, you'll need a harness to interface the two.

[biggy238]

Check out swaphelper.

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[Roadblock]

Originally Posted by biggy238

Check out swaphelper.

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That's just to make the cruise and tack work right? I think I can get both of those with a full swap kit from DCS.

[biggy238]

Originally Posted by Roadblock

That's just to make the cruise and tack work right? I think I can get both of those with a full swap kit from DCS.

To my knowledge digital cruise is not working. There is a work around to run the apps on an 03-05 engine and use the cruise actuator from an excursion, but I think this is the only way unless I'm mistaken.

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[thatguy69]

So don't buy anything from dcs, they've really gone downhill quality wise if you read much on the fummins swap fb pages. you can save quite a few bucks from buying your adapter plate from a guy named Mike Fuchs, I can put you in touch. He also makes a bracket that allows you to run the 6.4 alternator and ac compressor on the Cummins motor and really simplifies things. I have a ppumpd 24v in mine and I'd say I'm right around the power level you want running 6x13s with a 62/65/14 phatshaft. It honestly doesn't smoke hardly at all if you drive with some sense. I built a bracket utilizing the vp44 throttle assembly and cable, it hasn't gave me a bit of trouble and was pretty simple to setup. To setup cruise I did the cruise helper and I had a lot of doubts on how well it would work seeing as my pump is turned up and so touchy, but it honestly works like factory. My trucks been down for a year but I put 17k on this setup and really enjoyed it. If money wasn't an option I'd of went common rail, but finding one with lower miles is tough and they bring big money. If you talk on the phone a lot while driving or your old lady doesn't appreciate some engine chatter you may wanna go common rail. It doesn't bother me much as I always have the stereo cranked

[biggy238]

There you go.

My DCS mounts came with no packing around the parts, so the best the powder coat off of themselves in shipping. That was 2018.
Those were the only parts I used from them.

I keep telling myself I'm going to fix my alternator light, but I just keep ignoring it instead 😁



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[gwhammy]

I'm 12 valve all the way. My 09 runs great it's the transmission I have to fight with the computer. Grossing 36,000 a lot and once up to speed it maintains 65 great. I've found a guy local that will drive tune a trans and that my last hope to getting it shifting right. Not sure on the 2010 I'm working on right now, it might get a 47rh. The one in my 95 shorth bed works flawlessly.

[thatguy69]

Originally Posted by gwhammy

I'm 12 valve all the way. My 09 runs great it's the transmission I have to fight with the computer. Grossing 36,000 a lot and once up to speed it maintains 65 great. I've found a guy local that will drive tune a trans and that my last hope to getting it shifting right. Not sure on the 2010 I'm working on right now, it might get a 47rh. The one in my 95 shorth bed works flawlessly.

No luck with randy Gillam?

[gwhammy]

Nope works about the same as the cummins conversion tune, flares with a trailer terrible if I don't shift it by hand. If I drive like an old lady it shifts good. Shame to have a good transmission with a crack whore computer!!