Injecting fuel pre turbo? - Page 2 - Competition Diesel.Com

Hurley · 08-10-2012, 09:26 AM

jsut make sure the injection is not tied to your normal fuel shut off.

SINNER · 08-10-2012, 09:50 AM

Use nitrous to help atomize the fuel. Works like a charm.

dieselstudent11 · 08-10-2012, 11:18 AM

SHughes · 08-10-2012, 11:27 AM

What's the matter student???

Epically post by a dumb phone.

dieselstudent11 · 08-10-2012, 11:32 AM

Nothing my question was answered by JQ on the first page now I think you guys are making fun of me and if you keep it up you just mite hurt my feelings

4x4dually · 08-10-2012, 11:38 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lostnwalmart

Why would you inject an unmeasured amount of fuel into an engine that is throttled by fuel??

Would it work if you measured the amount?

Lostnwalmart · 08-10-2012, 11:41 AM

Yup your right we take the internet that serious .....

4x4dually · 08-10-2012, 11:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lostnwalmart

Yup your right we take the internet that serious .....

Yup.

I'd sure hate to lose a rubber boot and dump that fuel onto the hot motor. I'm sure the #2 will end up eating the boots.

SHughes · 08-10-2012, 11:54 AM

Mites have feelings??

Epically post by a dumb phone.

ENafziger · 08-10-2012, 11:55 AM

Are you talking of injecting liquid diesel fuel before the compressor wheel? What do you think liquid impingement on the blades at 100,000 rpm is going to do?

Fumigated gasoline injected into the intake via PFI injectors is being done in the research side. It's called RCCI (reactivity controlled compression ignition). There are a few papers on it if you're interested. At moderate loads/speeds, it can be used at about 85% replacement.

Ohio State developed a diesel fogging apparatus that worked to introduce fuel into the intake for homogeneous charge compression ignition. I don't think this is what you want to do.

It's more common to introduce propane pre-turbo if you're wanting something to play with

--Eric

*JQmile* · 08-10-2012, 01:04 PM

Maybe on a non-turbo engine? 1000hp IDI?? ;D

Lostnwalmart · 08-10-2012, 02:33 PM

You would need like 30 to 1 compression for that

*JQmile* · 08-10-2012, 08:16 PM

The math I did suggests that in a N/A application (for simplicity) diesel injected into the intake stream "should" ignite at about 12:1 compression. Whether or not you could get it started, or where 12:1 effective is crank-angle wise on a 20:1 engine, haven't got to that math yet.

*Toolman* · 08-10-2012, 09:01 PM

You probably want to be turning the motor at least 4000 RPM before you inject it. At that speed who needs timing anyway?

DIESEL_POWER · 08-10-2012, 10:01 PM

For this to even remotly work the camshaft timing events would need adjusted....Much closer to gasoline specs than diesel specs...

Not to mention the poor performance that would be induced due to the lack of fuel atomization...and the worry of runaway, due to no fuel regulation

IMO Bad idea.

Charger · 08-10-2012, 10:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DIESEL_POWER

For this to even remotly work the camshaft timing events would need adjusted....Much closer to gasoline specs than diesel specs...

Not to mention the poor performance that would be induced due to the lack of fuel atomization...and the worry of runaway, due to no fuel regulation

IMO Bad idea.

Lostnwalmart · 08-10-2012, 10:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JQmile

The math I did suggests that in a N/A application (for simplicity) diesel injected into the intake stream "should" ignite at about 12:1 compression. Whether or not you could get it started, or where 12:1 effective is crank-angle wise on a 20:1 engine, haven't got to that math yet.

Would you put a throttle plate on it to create vacumbe?

Smoken Gun · 08-10-2012, 11:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ENafziger

Are you talking of injecting liquid diesel fuel before the compressor wheel? What do you think liquid impingement on the blades at 100,000 rpm is going to do?

The diesel fuel would gently massage, lubricate, and exfoliate the compressor blades in some sort of zany spa affect thingy which would exponentially increase the compressor wheel's efficieny, thus enticing the turbolator to produce more whistlepounds of boost...right? Right? Right???

dieselstudent11 · 08-10-2012, 11:36 PM

Well I think if you ran this in conjuction with a high rpm dyson 12v vaccum cleaner pulling air through the turbo then youd have a lower compression due the increased volume on the cold side of the turbo. Therefore reducing compression to approx 13:1 allowing a couple hundred ccs to pass thru a compressor wheel of about 70mm therefore causing increased combustion pressure IE increased horsepower/torque. Look out for me in the diesel power challenge next year with this set up thanks for the informative posts everyone.

NicG · 08-10-2012, 11:44 PM

Reading this hurt my brain......

08-10-2012, 09:26 AM	#21
Hurley Name: Hurley Title: BLAKLUNG Status: Not Here Join Date: Apr 2008 Location: Statesville, NC Member`s Gallery Posts: 3,698	jsut make sure the injection is not tied to your normal fuel shut off. __________________ THIS IS COMPD. 95 2500 RCSB 2wd back-halfed and 4-linked 5x14/7mm +100cc/4k/11-blade billet 63/68/.91 T4 539/989 03 RCLB 4x4, SSR

08-10-2012, 09:50 AM	#22
SINNER Name: SINNER Title: BallSoHard U Status: Not Here Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: The Un Free State Member`s Gallery Posts: 4,803	Use nitrous to help atomize the fuel. Works like a charm. __________________ 2004 f-350 cc drw Build a man a fire and he'll be warm for a day... Set a man on fire and he'll be warm for the rest of his life.

08-10-2012, 11:32 AM	#25
dieselstudent11 Name: dieselstudent11 Title: Rookie Status: Not Here Join Date: Mar 2012 Member`s Gallery Posts: 24	Nothing my question was answered by JQ on the first page now I think you guys are making fun of me and if you keep it up you just mite hurt my feelings Last edited by dieselstudent11; 08-10-2012 at 11:33 AM.

08-10-2012, 11:55 AM	#30
ENafziger Name: ENafziger Title: Too Much Time Status: Not Here Join Date: Oct 2008 Location: Knoxville, TN Member`s Gallery Posts: 843	Are you talking of injecting liquid diesel fuel before the compressor wheel? What do you think liquid impingement on the blades at 100,000 rpm is going to do? Fumigated gasoline injected into the intake via PFI injectors is being done in the research side. It's called RCCI (reactivity controlled compression ignition). There are a few papers on it if you're interested. At moderate loads/speeds, it can be used at about 85% replacement. Ohio State developed a diesel fogging apparatus that worked to introduce fuel into the intake for homogeneous charge compression ignition. I don't think this is what you want to do. It's more common to introduce propane pre-turbo if you're wanting something to play with --Eric __________________ 2006 Dodge 3500 SRW, 62/476 twins, Flux 2.5s, G56, Carli 2.65s, etc. Jer. 33:3 2003 Ford Excursion, '97 Cummins P-Pump, HX35/475 twins, studded and o-ringed, ZF6/271, forged Rickson 19.5s. 1991.5 W250, NV4500, Rickson 19.5s, HE351, long travel suspension build Last edited by ENafziger; 08-10-2012 at 11:59 AM.

08-10-2012, 01:04 PM	#31
JQmile Name: JQmile Title: Comp Diesel Sponsor Status: Not Here Join Date: Nov 2006 Member`s Gallery Posts: 6,976	Maybe on a non-turbo engine? 1000hp IDI?? ;D __________________ 89 Dodge 972rwhp on the hose, still a VE!

08-10-2012, 11:18 AM	#23
dieselstudent11 Name: dieselstudent11 Title: Rookie Status: Not Here Join Date: Mar 2012 Member`s Gallery Posts: 24

08-10-2012, 08:16 PM	#33
JQmile Name: JQmile Title: Comp Diesel Sponsor Status: Not Here Join Date: Nov 2006 Member`s Gallery Posts: 6,976	The math I did suggests that in a N/A application (for simplicity) diesel injected into the intake stream "should" ignite at about 12:1 compression. Whether or not you could get it started, or where 12:1 effective is crank-angle wise on a 20:1 engine, haven't got to that math yet. __________________ 89 Dodge 972rwhp on the hose, still a VE!

08-10-2012, 09:01 PM	#34
Toolman Name: Toolman Title: Comp Diesel Sponsor Status: Not Here Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: Southern Michigan Member`s Gallery Posts: 1,077	You probably want to be turning the motor at least 4000 RPM before you inject it. At that speed who needs timing anyway? __________________ 04.5 Dodge ,PPE Dual Fueler, Stainless Diesel, Bullseye Power Turbo, Fass Fuel Systems, M & J Tool Converter and shafts, Smarty UDC Tuning , Isspro Gauges, Fluidampr B&B Tooling 269-496-9021 B & B Tooling Intakes and custom machined parts. Member of Drive by Wire Mafia

08-10-2012, 10:01 PM	#35
DIESEL_POWER Name: DIESEL_POWER Title: NGM Diesel Status: Not Here Join Date: Jul 2006 Member`s Gallery Posts: 5,178	For this to even remotly work the camshaft timing events would need adjusted....Much closer to gasoline specs than diesel specs... Not to mention the poor performance that would be induced due to the lack of fuel atomization...and the worry of runaway, due to no fuel regulation IMO Bad idea. __________________ Proverbs 3:5-6 (KJV) 5 Trust in the Lord with all thine heart; and lean not unto thine own understanding. 6 In all thy ways acknowledge him, and he shall direct thy paths.

08-10-2012, 11:36 PM	#39
dieselstudent11 Name: dieselstudent11 Title: Rookie Status: Not Here Join Date: Mar 2012 Member`s Gallery Posts: 24	Well I think if you ran this in conjuction with a high rpm dyson 12v vaccum cleaner pulling air through the turbo then youd have a lower compression due the increased volume on the cold side of the turbo. Therefore reducing compression to approx 13:1 allowing a couple hundred ccs to pass thru a compressor wheel of about 70mm therefore causing increased combustion pressure IE increased horsepower/torque. Look out for me in the diesel power challenge next year with this set up thanks for the informative posts everyone.

08-10-2012, 11:44 PM	#40
NicG Name: NicG Title: the only way to fly... Status: Not Here Join Date: Jul 2011 Location: Fortuna, CA Member`s Gallery Posts: 373	Reading this hurt my brain...... __________________ 2007 Ram 3500 drw 4x4 5.9 Ponci turbos;s300 over gt4202 ,EfiLive by StarlightDiesel, fass 150,ARP studs,two stage NX,Industrial Injt 45lpm,dual fueler85%+stk,meth,billet push rods,South bend twin disk, ect...ect...