Better front driveshaft?

What is a waffle, do you mean serrated.... The flange with the serrated locking mesh......


You would be surprised at what happens when the centering joint runs out of grease and wears thru the part of the flange yoke, or the joint runs out of grease, and has everything to do with why people break things...


Give me Detail.... what is a waffle joint? where is it used, and on what and where on the vehicle can you find it...

I never heard of a waffle joint, never ever...

Supershafts said:

What is a waffle, do you mean serrated.... The flange with the serrated locking mesh......


You would be surprised at what happens when the centering joint runs out of grease and wears thru the part of the flange yoke, or the joint runs out of grease, and has everything to do with why people break things...


Give me Detail.... what is a waffle joint? where is it used, and on what and where on the vehicle can you find it...

I never heard of a waffle joint, never ever...

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The flange with the serrated locking mesh......

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correct.... this one has a spacer in it. The shops I've talked too all recommend getting rid of that with a CV in it's place.




Circled is the piece that broke on mine and several others that I've seen. It's the flange that connects to the T-case. As you can see, it's a very thin area of metal that takes a lot of stress. All the grease you can get in the U-joint wouldn't help that piece from breaking. It's probably fine for the life of a truck that's not out doing 20psi boost launches.

I run this in my puller, and i have a customer that's running the same set up ast me in drive's his truck daily put miles on end on it and hasnt had a problem yet. His keptt braking where triton has hit circles. Do some research in you will find that alot of guys are doing away with it. But they have good shops building in balanceing the shafts.

Ok so the serrated flange they told you is bad... Interesting...
They most likely said that because they probably can't balance it with the serrated flange on the shaft, balancing the shaft without the flange can cause a problem...
SO blame the flange... the serrated flange which is in FACT stronger in holding the flange yoke to the comp flange on the pinion is a bad design, they are so off base with that bs.....
Have you broke that flange where the joints cap is pressed into it ? ? but you are breaking the cv flange yoke on the CV... but not that flange on the diff? amazing, right....keep reading...
The stud weld yoke is thinner on all sides compared to the flange yoke, but you didn't have a problem with the centering joint or the joint...

The flange yoke you have circled is a 1330 series flange yoke...

Why not upgrade to the 1350 series then....

Just so you know.....if you are talking about the part of the flange yoke that is the bridge for the centering joint, there is no stress from 20 psi at that point... in fact there is no stress on the centering bridge at 60 psi


That area there is not the area that see's stress....so if you aren't twisting the weld yoke off the rear shaft...or the stud weld yoke (part welded into the shaft) then you have a different problem, and you, and they haven't fixed it....

So you know, the piece bridging the 2 sides of the flange yoke is simply to center the flange yoke to the stud yoke so the H-yoke doesn't flop around and BREAK either end......
IF, IF you break that section, it is ONLY because you have a issue with the centering joint...

The flange is turning off the case comp flange, that power is transferred to the joint cap and cross, that psi is transferred to the other side of the cross to the h-yoke, the h-yoke puts that psi to the other end and it starts over to the shaft... the bridge sections simply center the shaft as it turns so the h-yoke doesn't go into bind and then break something

.

As for like i said earlier... on the serrated flange, you were fed bs, when you make big power, you'll see that you will be sold serrated flanges..... just take a peak at whats in 3000+ hp pro mods.....no more end yokes, serrated comp flanges and serrated yoke flanges


.

My customer also broke the flange on the front diff. Building boost. guess what snap. They will break to. His truck is lifted running 36 in has no cv in it. Drive Line's Plus builds all my shafts. Also builds them for customers.

Where did the flange break ? the only diff between the factory AAM flange and the one in the picture is the lack of serrate locking pieces, which aids in the locking strength to the comp flange, as has been proven in pro mod

Supershafts said:

Ok so the serrated flange they told you is bad... Interesting...
They most likely said that because they probably can't balance it with the serrated flange on the shaft, balancing the shaft without the flange can cause a problem...
SO blame the flange... the serrated flange which is in FACT stronger in holding the flange yoke to the comp flange on the pinion is a bad design, they are so off base with that bs.....
Have you broke that flange where the joints cap is pressed into it ? ? but you are breaking the cv flange yoke on the CV... but not that flange on the diff? amazing, right....keep reading...
The stud weld yoke is thinner on all sides compared to the flange yoke, but you didn't have a problem with the centering joint or the joint...

The flange yoke you have circled is a 1330 series flange yoke...

Why not upgrade to the 1350 series then....

Just so you know.....if you are talking about the part of the flange yoke that is the bridge for the centering joint, there is no stress from 20 psi at that point... in fact there is no stress on the centering bridge at 60 psi


That area there is not the area that see's stress....so if you aren't twisting the weld yoke off the rear shaft...or the stud weld yoke (part welded into the shaft) then you have a different problem, and you, and they haven't fixed it....

So you know, the piece bridging the 2 sides of the flange yoke is simply to center the flange yoke to the stud yoke so the H-yoke doesn't flop around and BREAK either end......
IF, IF you break that section, it is ONLY because you have a issue with the centering joint...

The flange is turning off the case comp flange, that power is transferred to the joint cap and cross, that psi is transferred to the other side of the cross to the h-yoke, the h-yoke puts that psi to the other end and it starts over to the shaft... the bridge sections simply center the shaft as it turns so the h-yoke doesn't go into bind and then break something

.

As for like i said earlier... on the serrated flange, you were fed bs, when you make big power, you'll see that you will be sold serrated flanges..... just take a peak at whats in 3000+ hp pro mods.....no more end yokes, serrated comp flanges and serrated yoke flanges


.

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tell you what..... I'll send you my broken shaft ( only the flange yoke is broken ), you build it to where it won't break... I'll test and advertise it for you. If what you build is all that... you may get some business from it cause, it's not a lack of grease that's causing issues.

I hope you have free wheelin hubs....

The op sounds like he needs to use a limiter on his front suspension or fix the trans drop, or have a shaft made for the angles he seems to be seeing...
You don't split or break flange yokes or h yokes unless you put them in Bind and force them to break...

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I do have "free wheelin hubs". I have the Dynatrac manual hub conversion kit with the Dynaloc manual hubs. I installed them around March/April of this year in preparation for the 10,000 mile Alaska trip I took in July.



This isn't the best picture, but yes I have limit straps for the front suspension as well.

Where did the flange break ?

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My flange broke in the EXACT spot as Ty's did posted above...the area circled in red broke on both sides. The drive shaft then slung around and shattered the electronics on the transfer case.

Here's a picture of what was going on when the shaft broke. I'm convinced that it was previously cracked, and nothing I did here was the root cause. In fact, the passenger front tire was hanging into the ravine in mid air, and the driver's side front tire was barely touching the ground at all...in fact, it would spin at an idle.






I don't have a typical "lift". I have a Carli Suspension 2.65" kit with rear leaves, track bar, sway bar, 4" rear bumps, etc. The truck sits about 2.5" higher in front than stock, and 0.5" in rear, but is adjustable with the LT Carli air bags. Front travel is ~10" and rear ~12".

You broke a set of Carli BJs?

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Unfortunately, yes. Here's what I saw when I looked under the truck:



Both sides are exactly the same. The lower BJs sheared on the tapered stud, so the threaded piece and nut are missing in action.



I called Sage, and he said they had a bad initial run on some of the ball joints, and they've significantly improved things since the ones I have. He's sending a new set out (timeframe unknown) for free since they have a lifetime warranty.

The bad news is I think they broke on the way back from Alaska pulling the camper. Significant play has developed, including in the axle shafts. The outer stub axles and u-joints seem fine (just replaced when I did the Dynatrac install), but the inner axles are worn BADLY.

It's hard to get a picture, but here you can see the flange around the u-joint is egged and worn:



It has also worn the axle shaft out by allowing back and forth play. The joint is loose up-down, side-to-side, around, etc





I presume this occured when the lower BJs broke, allowing the front wheels to be loose. This looseness causes the front hub u-joint to wobble when engaged. We had the front hubs locked for probably around 500 miles of gravel/dirt roads through Alaska and British Columbia.

So, now I'm looking for an upgraded front driveline as well as some chromoly inner axle shafts for the front...

--Eric

triton said:

tell you what..... I'll send you my broken shaft ( only the flange yoke is broken ), you build it to where it won't break... I'll test and advertise it for you. If what you build is all that... you may get some business from it cause, it's not a lack of grease that's causing issues.

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I dont belive its lack of grease grease either, i had to have a local driveline builder custom build me a driveline with a high angle cv for equipment, it is pretty damn big and he said if i break it, he will fix for free, im launching at 3800-4200 rpm with 37 inch tires on dirt.

Where are the pics of the broken flange yoke and whatever other shaft pieces broke ?

Where are the pics of the broken flange yoke and whatever other shaft pieces broke ?

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Well, almost 6 months later...I got the new Carli lower BJs installed, replaced under warranty. The ball/cup on the old ones were badly scarred. I also got the inner axles replaced, and used the Yukon 1540 series shafts.

Here's a couple pictures of where the driveshaft broke:







--Eric

You could try a 3r ser flange and socket assembly saginaw style cv.
The cornay cv would be another option...
You could try the 1350 centering flange style and go to a cv end yoke on the case if a cv end yoke is made to that output shafts dimensions.

When did that break exactly ? 1st gear, 2nd, cruising or in the field? ?

When did that break exactly ? 1st gear, 2nd, cruising or in the field? ?

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It broke in 4 Lo, 2nd gear. Neither of the front wheels were even getting traction. One wheel was in the air, and the other was just barely touching the ground.

I suspect that the shaft was previously weakened from jerking on logs, sledpulling, hauling heavy, being agressive offroad before, etc.

Do you know of a drop-in replacement that would be stronger, say from Tom Woods, Dennys, etc? Do you make custom shafts?

Thanks, Eric

becareful of the china in the mentioned names....

If you have FWH you could do a agricultural stlye CV (like woods and az high angle advertize) since it isn't going to be used at speed....

If you are going to use it at speed, like drag racing.....then we got a problem, and that is leaving you with one other option, and that is cornay , i tried to be a dealer for them (i would buy there parts and assemble there product in my shop), but i don't know what happened, 1st they were gonna, then they weren't, then last time i tried they said they're not...so just call them (303) 651-9099, i forget if you need to speak with pedro or rick, i haven't ordered a shaft from them in about a year....

Theirs is the best for angle and strength, and you'll probably keep it on the table for a day looking at it...

Thanks for the info! I'm going to give them a call and see what they can do.

Thanks again, Eric

Im gonna be calling them monday, i just had another big lift that needs the cornay here this afternoon....

Did you talk to Rick or Pedro?

Have they called you back...

Did you talk to Rick or Pedro?

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I called the number listed above to get some info about what they could make. The number picked up with Rick's voicemail. I explained what I needed, and am waiting on a call back as well.

From what I can tell from the website, it looks like I'm interested in the CVX-50 shafts using 1410 joints. Have you had experience with these? http://www.cornay.com/pdfs/Cornay_CVX-50_fact_sheet.pdf


--Eric

Yeah the cv30 and 50, i don't know wth is going on, im waiting for them to call me back to... Been leaving messages everyday, im about to send a fax with WTF on it in large crayon letters, and call me back under it...

How about clocking the transfer case with a clocking ring to eliminate drive line angle?

Tobin