Head bolt torque... the dirty limits - Competition Diesel.Com

onefour · 02-21-2010, 12:33 PM

So im forced to do my head gasket the cheap way. Which means no o-rings and no studs.

My plan is a 20 over gasket, and possibly new bolts, if the current ones dont pass...

I would like to know what lube to torque the bolts with... arp lube, motor oil, moly grease?

Im planning on pulling it down to the factory specs, doing a heat cycle, then checking all the torques, and torquing up in 5 ft/lb increments until the bolts feel funny, and repeating a couple more times.

Any other tips to keep the head down on stock stuff?

50 pounds of boost and lots of timing...

Rollin Coal · 02-21-2010, 12:45 PM

once the bolt feels "funny" its no good

danni's cummins · 02-21-2010, 12:56 PM

Sounded alright until the once it feels like its stretching i'll just go a few more part.

new bolts are cheap

onefour · 02-21-2010, 07:28 PM

cool, done... what about lube?

Rollin Coal · 02-21-2010, 07:29 PM

motor oil

Riflemanusmc · 02-21-2010, 07:31 PM

Use a stock HG. .20 not needed..

THE TANK · 02-21-2010, 07:34 PM

I ran 50psi and timing with stock head gasket and bolts. just use motor oil and I want 10lbs over stock should be good to go.

*JQmile* · 02-21-2010, 08:05 PM

If you're willing to push it, start at c.105 lb-ft, mark the bolts, and then tighten them by 5 or 10 lb-ft till you get to 150 lb-ft. If any of the bolts have turned way past the others, replace them. The center bolts will turn the most cause they're the longest, they'll turn maybe 1/8th of a turn past the others.

onefour · 02-21-2010, 11:45 PM

Right on thanks guys...

Why no 20 over gasket? Any reason in particular?

Anybody got a part number for a head bolt set?

Riflemanusmc · 02-23-2010, 10:21 PM

IMO The .20 HG is not needed for a non o ringed head or block. One of the urban legend's that have not been proven, just taken for gospel. To reduce CR, yes.

Smoke · 02-23-2010, 11:11 PM

Just spend the money on studs and be done with it. VERY cheap insurance. New bolts aren't cheap enough to fool with when you can find even a set of used studs that will be better than the bolts. Not worth much, but that's my

.

Free89W350 · 02-28-2010, 11:06 AM

Your going to spend just under $70 for new bolts from Cummins. I put the .020 in mine when I did it but like rifle said it isn't needed and I used regular motor oil for the lube. If you can afford it get a set of studs I wish I would have.

Got Smoke? · 02-28-2010, 06:15 PM

Agree with the others if studs aren't in the budget go with a new set of head bolts. You can get it and the headgasket drop shipped from Jeff (username Snedge) on here cheaper than going to your local Cummins most times.

I use head bolts with the Garmon method on my puller and its worked great for me so far.

1 Smear high temp grease on the threads of the bolts
2 install and TQ down at 50, 75, & then 100 ft lbs.
3 Give 30 minutes to cool then go up 5 ft/lbs every 30 minutes up to 150 ft/lbs.

Holds my 60PSI non-gated charger and all my fuel in my 97 without problems!

onefour · 02-28-2010, 11:16 PM

Cool, thats kind of what I did, but i dont think i left enough time for the bolts to cool down... Didnt really think of that part. I did have a few rests tho, cause torquin them son *****es down 5 lbs at a time from 100 lbs up sitting under the hood gets nasty...

Im dealing with an uneven sounding rev now, sounds like a weak hole... Dont know if its fuel or compression, but thats a whole nother issue...

Thanks everybody for the head gasket tips/tricks...

02-21-2010, 12:33 PM	#1
onefour Name: onefour Title: dinosaur power Status: Not Here Join Date: Oct 2009 Member`s Gallery Posts: 47	Head bolt torque... the dirty limits So im forced to do my head gasket the cheap way. Which means no o-rings and no studs. My plan is a 20 over gasket, and possibly new bolts, if the current ones dont pass... I would like to know what lube to torque the bolts with... arp lube, motor oil, moly grease? Im planning on pulling it down to the factory specs, doing a heat cycle, then checking all the torques, and torquing up in 5 ft/lb increments until the bolts feel funny, and repeating a couple more times. Any other tips to keep the head down on stock stuff? 50 pounds of boost and lots of timing...

02-21-2010, 12:45 PM	#2
Rollin Coal Name: Rollin Coal Title: Fabricator Status: Not Here Join Date: Oct 2008 Member`s Gallery Posts: 2,232	once the bolt feels "funny" its no good __________________ R.I.P. Jonathan Link

02-21-2010, 12:56 PM	#3
danni's cummins Name: danni's cummins Title: rookie girl Status: Not Here Join Date: Jan 2010 Location: pendleton, or Member`s Gallery Posts: 133	Sounded alright until the once it feels like its stretching i'll just go a few more part. new bolts are cheap __________________ 2003 QCSB, 4x4, 62/71/14 over S472 1.10a/r, Turbo Socks from Levi, SBDD clutch, Flux 3's, Floor it Stage 3.5, Glacier Diesel Power Fuel Boss with hyperdrive pulley,GDP MK2 big line,Amsoil bypass w/EABP110 Smarty TNT/TST, Isspro EV2 Full Billet 48RE with PCS controller

02-21-2010, 07:29 PM	#5
Rollin Coal Name: Rollin Coal Title: Fabricator Status: Not Here Join Date: Oct 2008 Member`s Gallery Posts: 2,232	motor oil __________________ R.I.P. Jonathan Link

02-21-2010, 07:34 PM	#7
THE TANK Name: THE TANK Title: rookie Status: Not Here Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: Eastern shore of Maryland Member`s Gallery Posts: 217	I ran 50psi and timing with stock head gasket and bolts. just use motor oil and I want 10lbs over stock should be good to go. __________________ 2006 3500 loaded 6spd, bully dog 1990 dodge 550 SCRAPED! Now pullin 1989 peterbilt 400++ cummins TEAM MONKEY BUSINESS

02-21-2010, 07:28 PM	#4
onefour Name: onefour Title: dinosaur power Status: Not Here Join Date: Oct 2009 Member`s Gallery Posts: 47	cool, done... what about lube?

02-21-2010, 07:31 PM	#6
Riflemanusmc Name: Riflemanusmc Title: Green Behind the Ears Status: Not Here Join Date: Feb 2009 Member`s Gallery Posts: 75	Use a stock HG. .20 not needed..

02-21-2010, 08:05 PM	#8
JQmile Name: JQmile Title: Comp Diesel Sponsor Status: Not Here Join Date: Nov 2006 Member`s Gallery Posts: 6,976	If you're willing to push it, start at c.105 lb-ft, mark the bolts, and then tighten them by 5 or 10 lb-ft till you get to 150 lb-ft. If any of the bolts have turned way past the others, replace them. The center bolts will turn the most cause they're the longest, they'll turn maybe 1/8th of a turn past the others. __________________ 89 Dodge 972rwhp on the hose, still a VE!

02-21-2010, 11:45 PM	#9
onefour Name: onefour Title: dinosaur power Status: Not Here Join Date: Oct 2009 Member`s Gallery Posts: 47	Right on thanks guys... Why no 20 over gasket? Any reason in particular? Anybody got a part number for a head bolt set?

02-23-2010, 10:21 PM	#10
Riflemanusmc Name: Riflemanusmc Title: Green Behind the Ears Status: Not Here Join Date: Feb 2009 Member`s Gallery Posts: 75	IMO The .20 HG is not needed for a non o ringed head or block. One of the urban legend's that have not been proven, just taken for gospel. To reduce CR, yes.

02-23-2010, 11:11 PM	#11
Smoke Name: Smoke Title: VP Puller Playin Catch-Up Status: Not Here Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: Cynthiana, Kentucky Member`s Gallery Posts: 842	Just spend the money on studs and be done with it. VERY cheap insurance. New bolts aren't cheap enough to fool with when you can find even a set of used studs that will be better than the bolts. Not worth much, but that's my . __________________ 1999 Dodge - Puller 2002 Dodge - Tow Rig 1999 Dodge - Project Truck... Heartless, awaiting transplant.

02-28-2010, 11:06 AM	#12
Free89W350 Name: Free89W350 Title: Broke Status: Not Here Join Date: Dec 2009 Location: Pen Argyl Pa Member`s Gallery Posts: 63	Your going to spend just under $70 for new bolts from Cummins. I put the .020 in mine when I did it but like rifle said it isn't needed and I used regular motor oil for the lube. If you can afford it get a set of studs I wish I would have.

02-28-2010, 06:15 PM	#13
Got Smoke? Name: Got Smoke? Title: Too Much Time Status: Not Here Join Date: Oct 2006 Location: Gallatin,TN Member`s Gallery Posts: 4,728	Agree with the others if studs aren't in the budget go with a new set of head bolts. You can get it and the headgasket drop shipped from Jeff (username Snedge) on here cheaper than going to your local Cummins most times. I use head bolts with the Garmon method on my puller and its worked great for me so far. 1 Smear high temp grease on the threads of the bolts 2 install and TQ down at 50, 75, & then 100 ft lbs. 3 Give 30 minutes to cool then go up 5 ft/lbs every 30 minutes up to 150 ft/lbs. Holds my 60PSI non-gated charger and all my fuel in my 97 without problems! __________________ Mark 2007 2500 Mega 68RFE FirePunk EFI/CSP5 & TCM tuning, Edge CTS II. 1997 2500 Jokerfab cyl head, PDR street cam, FDS benched pump, DFI 5x18's, HX35 63/67, FirePunk 47RE & anteater. 2003 Jetta TDI 5spd "DZL WGN" lot's of mods

02-28-2010, 11:16 PM	#14
onefour Name: onefour Title: dinosaur power Status: Not Here Join Date: Oct 2009 Member`s Gallery Posts: 47	Cool, thats kind of what I did, but i dont think i left enough time for the bolts to cool down... Didnt really think of that part. I did have a few rests tho, cause torquin them son *****es down 5 lbs at a time from 100 lbs up sitting under the hood gets nasty... Im dealing with an uneven sounding rev now, sounds like a weak hole... Dont know if its fuel or compression, but thats a whole nother issue... Thanks everybody for the head gasket tips/tricks...