New headgasket leaking

Pertura

Pertura

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Sep 16, 2009
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13
So, I blew a headgasket a while ago, it started pouring coolant out right above the oil cooler. I got the head decked and o-ring grooves made, grooves were bit wider than I wanted. I ended up using 1,10mm (.043") wire in 0,75mm (.029") deep groove, leaving me with 0,35mm (.014") of protrusion. Protrusion is a bit on the high side, but I believe that is still acceptable?

The head dropped in smoothly, I torqued it down to 130 ft-lbs in five steps, using the Cummins torque sequence. I let it sit for couple of hours before pouring coolant in, after that I put the Eberspächer (or Espar) on to circulate the coolant and to get the air out, then I plugged the block heater in. Block heater was on during daytime and during nighttime it was off to create some sort of heat cycles. After couple of days I did the first retorque, everything went fine and bolts turned from 1/8 to 1/4 of a turn.

I had bought new SHCS for the install, but when ordering the bolts, I mixed up the amounts of short and mid length bolts. So I ended up with double amount of short bolts and half the amount of mid length bolts, so I used six old bolts to get the head on. I got the new bolts yesterday and went to replace the old ones, then things started to look bit weird. I removed old bolts one at a time and put new one in and torqued it to 130ft-lbs. But, every bolt had small amount of coolant in the threads and when I got to the bolts in the passenger side front, coolant started leaking. Bolts #18, #25 and #26 were the ones that created the leaks, leak stopped right after I got the bolt torqued.

Gasket is aftermarket, brand is Glaser. But I really have hard time believing that gasket could be so bad, that it would start leaking before the engine has even been running. Torque wrench was checked before the head installation, it was within 1%. Bolts are 12.9 socket head cap screws with suitable washers, the lube used is ARP Ultra Torque. Block threads were also bottom tapped and cleaned. So I'm bit confused, what could be causing the coolant leak?
 
Some bolts run through coolant passages, should be the ones on the passnger side of the block. Not a big deal, if they leak after you run it, put some liquid teflon on the threads.
 
The aftermarket gasket is the problem...

And are you using factory head bolts or some other bolts?
 
Bolts are socket head cap screws, similar to Mighty Diesel's bolts. Yesterday I did another retorque, also cleaned every bolt hole with vacuum cleaner. Today block heater was plugged in, gasket weeped very little amount of coolant in couple of spots in passenger side of the block. Leak was way smaller than before, so I'm beginning to think that head has been floating on the o-rings and has not been pressing other parts of the gasket enough against the block.
 
I have no experience with o-rings, but there's no way that the HG should seep with a couple of head bolts loose. Some bolts do go into water jackets, but the gasket is still clamped with all the other bolts.
 
diesel_importer said:
I have no experience with o-rings, but there's no way that the HG should seep with a couple of head bolts loose. Some bolts do go into water jackets, but the gasket is still clamped with all the other bolts.
Click to expand...
Yeah, it shouldn't be seeping coolant if the head is properly clamped down. But since retorque made things bit better, I would assume that this has something to do with the o-rings having that much protrusion and floating the head on the gasket. Gasket in std. thickness. Seems like I will be taking the head out once again
 
Pertura said:
Yeah, it shouldn't be seeping coolant if the head is properly clamped down. But since retorque made things bit better, I would assume that this has something to do with the o-rings having that much protrusion and floating the head on the gasket. Gasket in std. thickness. Seems like I will be taking the head out once again
Click to expand...

^^ this

had the same problem with my firerings until i found out they have to be torqued down to 150lb to get the proper crush. sounds like to me your not getting enough crush on the orings.
 
SPEEDSHIFT said:
Some bolts run through coolant passages, should be the ones on the passnger side of the block. Not a big deal, if they leak after you run it, put some liquid teflon on the threads.
Click to expand...

None of the bolts go into the coolant passage, they are all blind holes.
 
Cummin_un_glued said:
^^ this

had the same problem with my firerings until i found out they have to be torqued down to 150lb to get the proper crush. sounds like to me your not getting enough crush on the orings.
Click to expand...
Seems that this was the deal. On the last retorque I went to 140ft/lbs and no signs of leak any more. The short bolts are now quarter of a turn past where they were after the initial torque to 130ft/lbs, so some sort of headgasket crushing has happened.
 
Sounds like it's a combination of protrusion/aftermarket gasket/torque issues. I had a similar problem trying to get a double O-ring arrangement to seat. Second time around, I went from 135lbs of torque to 150lbs. And did a bunch of cold/hot cycles with re-torques before I pushed it.
 
I'd say put a few miles on it and keep an eye on it. Could be that the new gasket just hasn't bonded to the metal surfaces without heat and when you loosen it off it's separating enough to weep. Keep an eye on coolant/oil level and condition. If it all looks good, run it.
 
Have been driving the truck for a week now and seems that there are no leaks any more. Let's hope it stays that way. Thank you guys for the help
 
I am also in the process of doing head gasket. Head out getting decked. Have been reading and trying to determine the proper method to torque the studs..
Have read some users that go 100# the 120# then 140# following stock pattern.

Have read some users that after initial torque when they start the next stage they loosen nut then pull to the higher values?

What is the best method to follow. Both sound like they will achieve the final 140#

I was concerned about loosening nut that I just tightened. But reading it also makes some sense. One post I found a user that actually said to re-lube the washer and nut before final torque value?

Advice appreciated as this is the 1st time for me on the truck/diesel. Have had hobby cars that have always ben just pulled to final # desired and run.

Thanks..
 
Yes you should torque in stock sequence. I usually do 30, 60, 90, 110, 120, 130 etc. after each sequence and you restart, loosen that nut and retighten. After a few heat cycle check torque again and retorque to desired value. I usually do this the following day, 7 days later and one month later. Always adjust valve lash after retorqing
 
Gibson

Doing the increments for installation and then one smooth pull for retorques? This is something I haven't seen clarifies.

Fwiw I had coolant seeping on the exhaust side after a 10 over gasket and arp's. 111000 miles on that install now with no further issues. Mild truck build though.

From my Not-So-Smart phone
 
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