What injectors do you run?

Goose said:
We love fun. If you know anything about Comp D you would know we are the mother fukin definition of fun.
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That post reminds me of someone.

[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=83yHSxowows"]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=83yHSxowows[/ame]
 
OrangeNV said:
i do believe all you would have to do is ask weston a clear question, then he would most likely explain

taunting him and questioning his intelligence is surely not the way to entice him to post something nice lol

the way the OP went about it as well as cosmic they should have titled this thread.....can anyone disprove 7 holes function better than 5. WHICH if they had searched anything regarding this topic they would have found several great threads. the best threads of all have been deleted from another site because certain adults do not know how to conduct themselves and open their mouth instead of sticking their foot in it
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See that's exactly how everybody has misread my posts. I was trying to keep the discussion focussed on one thing, and one thing only, and that was underlying factors that affect atomization in general. Everybody else, including Weston, read things into my posts that I did not intend and this started to devolve into another 7 hole vs 5 hole thread. In one post I clearly said that had nothing to do with what I was trying to discuss but either attention or comprehension related to reading around here is limited. For as much as people have wanted to label me a troll, I'm the one person who tried to have a discussion with a very narrow focus. When I saw everybody was ignoring this and kept trying to turn it into a 7 hole vs 5 hole debate I just went ahead and added fuel to that fire.

I'll now say it again. Nowhere in this thread have I tried advocating for the superiority of any specific injector. Nowhere in this thread have I made any recommendations regarding any specific injector for any specific application. Does some of the content of my posts have application to the 7 hole vs 5 hole debate that keeps popping up? Yes, but I'm not the one making the leap and doing that application.

Obviously there is more to injector selection than simply picking the nozzle with the maximum atomization potential. Factors like cylinder pressure will determine the ideal fuel droplet size as well as optimal jet characteristics. In some applications a nozzle resulting in a lower degree of atomization will be the superior choice. One also needs to take internal injector design characteristics into account too. So there is much more to selecting the right injector than just hole size and count. I also noted those were important considerations in other posts. Nobody should question Weston's first hand experience with how different injector configurations respond in different applications. He also probably has more experience than anybody with how changing a specific characteristic of an injector will affect its performance in a specific application. If a person wants to know which specific injector will work best for their application and why, there is probably nobody more qualified than Weston to tell them, based on experience which one to pick. I did not, and would not, pretend that I could do this.

Here's the point of my serious posts in this thread. Weston's real world experience qualifies him to tell somebody what injector will work best for them and he will most likely be correct most of the time. When they ask him why, he is qualified, based on his experience to tell them what he has observed to be the case with different injector design characteristics. When they ask him why that design is best his answer is because with all his time and testing that is what he has observed. That is completely legitimate. He is also qualified, based on his experience, to predict how specific design changes will affect performance. Some people however want to know why those observations are the way they are beyond being told that's just the way it is. This does not mean his observations are not correct, just that there is science that lies behind why they work that way. Science by the way which does work in the real world, and science which people like Bosch engineers and research scientists spend a long time in school studying so they can design the components they do, which in turn people like Weston figure out how to effectively combine and modify to make high performance injectors. If anybody goes back and rereads my posts from this perspective, and not reading any of the 5 hole vs 7 bs into them, they will see that everything I posted points to an underlying scientific explanation for the observations that Weston knows well.

To people not so blinded to trying to defend Weston against supposed attackers, they will see that every bit of legitimate information I posted adds an extra layer of explanation to everything he posted. I do not claim to have a fraction of Weston's knowledge about injector design and performance. What I do have is knowledge of the relevant science. A conversation that blends Weston's first hand experience with the underlying science is something everybody can learn from. People with injector testing experience can benefit from a deeper understanding of the foundational scientific principles and people with a knowledge of the science principles can benefit from a knowledge of the injector testing experience.
 
You may be surprised how much of this "Scientific" research I have and will continue to look at. Even though it is tedious and boring, it gives us a guidline for the direction we should be taking. Many of these research projects have a far larger budget than anyone could pick up the tab for in this industry, we cater this information to our own benefit.

My main point was the "salesmen" of this industry throw around the coin term atomization while knowing very little of the data behind it.
 
Smokem said:
You may be surprised how much of this "Scientific" research I have and will continue to look at. Even though it is tedious and boring, it gives us a guidline for the direction we should be taking. Many of these research projects have a far larger budget than anyone could pick up the tab for in this industry, we cater this information to our own benefit.

My main point was the "salesmen" of this industry throw around the coin term atomization while knowing very little of the data behind it.
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I think we both overstated things for emphasis in our posts, that's the nature of the game. I would be surprised if you didn't encorporate some scientific research into what you do. I think you also realize most of the references I linked in my replies to you were not in fact intended for you but for others reading the thread.

I agree with you on your main point and would suggest that could be generalized to many people throw around terms with specific technical meanings while knowing little about it period.
 
I can't believe this thread has went 11 pages in about 3 days! I dont know much about injectors, but I figured $315 for a set decent injectors (Black Friday Sale @ CPP) was pretty good.

I'm sure there is a great deal of difference between a well built injector and some random nozzle thrown on an injector....... But my 24v has a cheap set of 200 hp injectors from doghouse diesel, they run clean if you drive easy, don't haze @ idle, and make lots of power.
 
diesel_importer said:
I can't believe this thread has went 11 pages in about 3 days! I dont know much about injectors, but I figured $315 for a set decent injectors (Black Friday Sale @ CPP) was pretty good.

I'm sure there is a great deal of difference between a well built injector and some random nozzle thrown on an injector....... But my 24v has a cheap set of 200 hp injectors from doghouse diesel, they run clean if you drive easy, don't haze @ idle, and make lots of power.
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I took that black Friday gamble once.....got what I paid for:

2011-06-05_15-08-55_791.jpg
 
I'm running 5x12 and like them a lot. They made good power this weekend. 330/660
My mpg are up alittle and re truck runs great.
 
im just here to look at the cool pictures.

but really just go buy a set of 4,5,6,and 7 hole injectors and run em all till you find a set ya like.. then ya got the real world experience.
 
I've run a few injectors, here's what I've found....

stock non i/c = some smoke, bad fuel mileage

DDP4+ (5x14) = cleaner, low smoke until pump was cranked, good fuel economy, limited to c.400rwhp

6x16s = hazed at idle, crazy smoke, need lots of timing

5x25s = hazed about the same as the 6x16s, crazy smoke, slightly more power.
 
I'm running 5x.012s. Nick at Low Budget Diesel Performance built them. They're balanced between 240-245bar and have an i/c injector spray angle. IIRC, that's 145*??

Anyhow, with my original, high mileage (400+k) pump tuned by me, they run pretty clean. No haze at idle unless it's on a cold-start (by that, I mean not at normal operating temp.). If I put my foot into it below 1500RPM they will certainly leave a cloud behind me. Anything above that with my foot into it and the turbo spooled, I only see a medium haze.

We'll see how they do when I get this Giles 12mm VE on fed by an ADII 165 supplied from an in-tank sump. :evil
 
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