Fluid damper

I wouldn't install one without the pins. " Too many come loose and ruin the crank" On my truck I don't see any way to drill the crank without pulling the radiator and intercooler.
Billy
 
Billyram said:
I wouldn't install one without the pins. " Too many come loose and ruin the crank" On my truck I don't see any way to drill the crank without pulling the radiator and intercooler.
Billy
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what kind of pin are you putting in, mine had a dail pin from fractory.
 
DRILL_PIN.gif


BBD
 
You wouldn't think so unless the bolts are sheared off somehow. Then it don't seem like the pins would hold it on good enough.
 
JFlagg said:
I have an ATI waiting to go on the 02 Doug, I'll let you know how I like assuming I ever get done, LOL
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I hope you dont plan on running a stock fan cause it wont work. I ran electric fans on my 12v and on my ppump 24v decieded to run the stock set up abd when i went to put the fan on, it hits big time. Probably need atleast a inch spacer to get enough clearance. I am trying to find a solution besides electric fans again so if i figure it out i will let you know. Tim
 
jlibert said:
As long as the factory bolts are tight this shouldn't be an issue even at 4,000 rpms right?
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I cant remeber most of ATI's salespitch from when i bought mine, but the one thing i remember making sense to me is that the reason for needing the dowl pins with the fluiddamper is because it is not big enough to work for one, and two being that they are not originally designed for high rpms. Tons of semi motors and other big motors run fluiddampers, but they are one, slow revving low rpm motors and two those dampers are huge like 5 inches thick and 18 to 24 inches across. The fluid damper for the dodge needs the pins cause at high rpms, it actually starts not being able to keep up with the motor and and will slap back and forth on the bolts. The weight in the fluid cannot move fast enough to keep up so it starts working against the motor. It makes sense to me so i went with ATI but i obviously have no data to back that up.

The ATI is nascar, nhra approved, no moving parts, rebuildable, lighter weight, less money and dont have to drill your crank. It just wont fit with stock fans. Tim
 
ILLINOISRAM said:
I cant remeber most of ATI's salespitch from when i bought mine, but the one thing i remember making sense to me is that the reason for needing the dowl pins with the fluiddamper is because it is not big enough to work for one, and two being that they are not originally designed for high rpms. Tons of semi motors and other big motors run fluiddampers, but they are one, slow revving low rpm motors and two those dampers are huge like 5 inches thick and 18 to 24 inches across. The fluid damper for the dodge needs the pins cause at high rpms, it actually starts not being able to keep up with the motor and and will slap back and forth on the bolts. The weight in the fluid cannot move fast enough to keep up so it starts working against the motor. It makes sense to me so i went with ATI but i obviously have no data to back that up.

The ATI is nascar, nhra approved, no moving parts, rebuildable, lighter weight, less money and dont have to drill your crank. It just wont fit with stock fans. Tim
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They need the pins because they are exactly working, and the harder they have to work, the more chance you need the pins, I did mine in the 3 open locations.



jlibert said:
As long as the factory bolts are tight this shouldn't be an issue even at 4,000 rpms right?
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If you did a good job torquing the bolts to specs I'd bet a bag of marbles it would be fine. Wouldn't hurt to keep a eye on it.

If the front was ever open again, I'd drill and pin it.
 
See, this is what gets me. On my car I have a fluiddampner and spinning 5800 r's with 6-8 (can't remember exactly) bolts with no pins. With 4 bolts on a cummins plus a pin, with the bolts torqued, how is there going to be any movement?? With the bolts in, is there some play, are the holes oversized too much??
 
There is a little play between the damper and the locating pin. The bolt circle is pretty small, and that damper is heavy.

Your car isn't going to work a damper like a 6 cyl diesel.

Fact is a few have come loose, in the end do what you feel is alright.
 
Joesixpack said:
There is a little play between the damper and the locating pin. The bolt circle is pretty small, and that damper is heavy.

Your car isn't going to work a damper like a 6 cyl diesel.

Fact is a few have come loose, in the end do what you feel is alright.
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Both dampners are heavy. The bolt circle is small. I miss quoted my r's on my car, it's 6800. Plus the motor is pushing 945 ponies (eng.dyno) One day I'll install the dampner and I'll see what's up during the process. Then I'll decide on what I'll do. Thanks for the info.

Oh, if I do decide to install a 2nd dowl pin, I won't be buying the kit above, too pricey. I'll just set the dampner up to locate the new hole and buy a dowl pin (under $5).
 
The picture of the fluidamper I posted was taken last year, it's the one I installed on BBD that turns around 6K rpm's, it performed flawlessly all last year.

FYI, I use blue locktight on the bolts.


BBD
 
I always use the red loctite, have for yrs. Anything that spins some r's gets the treatment.
 
ILLINOISRAM said:
I hope you dont plan on running a stock fan cause it wont work. I ran electric fans on my 12v and on my ppump 24v decieded to run the stock set up abd when i went to put the fan on, it hits big time. Probably need atleast a inch spacer to get enough clearance. I am trying to find a solution besides electric fans again so if i figure it out i will let you know. Tim
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I didn't realize it wouldn't clear until after I bought it, but I feel its a better product than the Fluiddampner except for the fit you mentioned. I'd like to stay with the stock fan, so you think a spacer would make it work?
 
JFlagg said:
I didn't realize it wouldn't clear until after I bought it, but I feel its a better product than the Fluiddampner except for the fit you mentioned. I'd like to stay with the stock fan, so you think a spacer would make it work?
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Yes, if i can find a spacer from Flex-a-Lite or something similar, i will let you know. If a spacer is not available, i am contemplating running a whole flex fan setup. Since mine is going to only be a weekend warrior, sled puller, it should be fine being direct drive. Everything i plan on doing with it involves heat so i might as well have it turn all the time. LOL I have just been unimpressed with my dual flex lite fans on my 12v. One i never run them unless im i just pulled or if im in town towing a trailer but what i havnt liked about them is the auto kick on sensor has never worked. It burnt the chincy wiring up with in a week and everytime it rains, the selanoids short out. and i have to hot wire them until i get a new 50amp snowplow selanoid which is 50$ a pop. Tim
 
Joesixpack said:
They need the pins because they are exactly working, and the harder they have to work, the more chance you need the pins, I did mine in the 3 open locations.






If you did a good job torquing the bolts to specs I'd bet a bag of marbles it would be fine. Wouldn't hurt to keep a eye on it.

If the front was ever open again, I'd drill and pin it.
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It sounds to me like the motor is outworking the damper. Im not knocking Fluidamper because i have no personal dealing with one. I just bought into the ATI's sales pitch and and liked the laser etched degree marks on the damper over the tape. Plus it lighter for less rotating mass equalling faster spoolup. Tim
 
Does anyone know about the ATI for a third gen? Is it out yet and if so what about the fan clearance issue with the fan?
I am not worried about pinning it and taking stuff off the front as its all coming off anyway to put in cam.
 
JohhnyFoxtrot said:
Does anyone know about the ATI for a third gen? Is it out yet and if so what about the fan clearance issue with the fan?
I am not worried about pinning it and taking stuff off the front as its all coming off anyway to put in cam.
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I would like to know also..
 
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