Which injector??

bracker8040 said:
Why would it be necessary to hand lap a precision ground part, especially after it is DLC coated?
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We dont touch the pintle. We fit/enlarge the bore in the nozzle by honing and lapping. The nozzles are received with a bore smaller than the diameter of the pintle. This is a tighter fit than a traditional mechanical pump nozzle has from say Bosch or Delphi, etc from the factory. This gives a very low leakage rate, but has a few caveats. One being that fuel quality must be high. The DLC will do much to deal with poor fuel, but gummy fuel from asphaltene precip or biological growth can cause a pintle to not slide freely with a tighter bore fit.

The secret is good fuel, well filtered and good maintenance practices. Most of our customers are aware of this and keep the maintenance up and watch for water contam, overheated fuel that accelerates asphaltenes, etc.
 
Soup Nazi said:
We dont touch the pintle. We fit/enlarge the bore in the nozzle by honing and lapping.
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How do you plan to control run out? Would you recommend a ball hone vs a cylinder honing machine process to achieve a tighter piston to wall clearance?

Soup Nazi said:
Yes, 7 hole sac style nozzle. Crappy photo attached showing the staggered drilling idea.
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Why a seven orifice staggered pattern? Leaves one hole to bridge the gap, most OEM of this type are all even numbered for a reason.
 
bracker8040 said:
How do you plan to control run out? Would you recommend a ball hone vs a cylinder honing machine process to achieve a tighter piston to wall clearance?
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What does lapping a pintle to nozzle have to do with piston to wall clearance?
 
a·nal·o·gy   
[uh-nal-uh-jee]
noun
similarity or comparability: I see no analogy between your problem and mine.
 
bracker8040 said:
Why a seven orifice staggered pattern? Leaves one hole to bridge the gap, most OEM of this type are all even numbered for a reason.
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Leading me to believe that is why Don's tend to work better than the OEM stuff.
I am assuming that you have not run his 24v stuff before?
 
RonA said:
Leading me to believe that is why Don's tend to work better than the OEM stuff.
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The OEM nozzle for a 24v is not designed for performance, but rather emissions, why would it compare to a sac type nozzle?

RonA said:
I am assuming that you have not run his 24v stuff before?
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This would be an incorrect assumption, I am familiar with the first Mach line-up 4.5/6/7.

j-rod said:
Of what type?
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One example; 6.7L Common Rail nozzle, 8-hole staggered.
 
So you have no first hand knowledge of p-pumped 24v injectors(and are in a forum for p-pumped 24V and a thread on injectors for a p-pumped 24V).
 
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This would be an assumption formed by yourself, and an incorrect one at that. I am discussing the 7-hole nozzle posted by Don, and nowhere did he say it was strictly for P-pumped applications did he?
 
Soup Nazi said:
This stops your high pressure fuel from leaking between the pintle bore and pintle and produces more HP, even with a lower fuel flow. This pintle moves faster than ANY on the market. Instead of needing radical lift values, we can inject the fuel faster by a faster lifting pintle. We also close faster. This retards dripping and low pressure fuel sprays toward the of the pressure curve.



HTH
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Care to support your claims with data? Needle lift data generated with the proper instrumentation will suffice. Vague needle impact data implying opening and closure is not acceptable to support the speed claim.

Injection rate and/or duration for equivalent quantities of fuel will effectively support the claim that higher lift values are not necessary with a high flow nozzle. Care to share the rate data or even a flow vs needle lift curve? Have you changed the seat to guide diameter ratio?

Have you increased needle closure impact with the "faster close" If so, how did you increase the strength of the nozzle to accept the additional loading? This has typically been a problem area with nozzle design.

Just a few basic fuel system development issues to be considered. If you like some help with these instrumentation tasks please feel free to PM.

Sell with data anything else is just noise. You may have something here with the integration of the DLC coating as used on current CR product on the older 12/24V mechanical applications but please, don't just expect folks to accept your claims with no support whatsoever. I for one expect more from F1.
 
dieselgreg said:
Injection rate and/or duration for equivalent quantities of fuel will effectively support the claim that higher lift values are not necessary with a high flow nozzle. Care to share the rate data or even a flow vs needle lift curve?
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Have you come to any further conclusion regarding flow vs needle lift? I know it was mentioned in past conversation, I would be curious to compare thoughts.
 
The new Mach 2 is almost here as well. Fully DLC coated pintle. 7 hole staggered. Smaller holes than the new Mach 4, but the design is almost exactly the same. Hole size is .21mm raw, before any additional work. They produce over 100HP and smoke very little for the power. Much less smoke over the older Mach 2. This is targeted to the 24VP guys mostly but would be a smokin good part for the P pump 24 conversion guys daily driver too.

The DLC coating covers the entire pintle. Adding wear resistance to the end/tip of the pintle. DLC is a very slippery coating. Friction reduction is a basic trait of DLC.

Got a call from a customer last week who we built some new Mach 6's for. He was ranting about the power and drivability. Pop pressure was set higher than we normally do. Around 310, to allow for some spring tension loss. In the end that is all that matters to us. Happy people. The rest is not worth arguing over.
 
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I've read many responses from you Don throughout the years, and I have one lingering question. Why can you not give a straight answer? When someone questions you, there are two reactions 1) You take it as a personal attack on your product or business 2) You avoid or ignore the fact that the question was even asked.

You claimed that the Denso style undercut on the needle and DLC coating increased your opening/closing speed, someone asked for any kind of proof, now you say it only matters that your customers are happy. I find it odd that your claims are only supported by your reasoning.
 
I am going to change any minds here. I realized that years ago already.

The Mach 4,5, 6 and 7's will start shipping in earnest next week.

They have lighter pintles, low friction DLC coating, tighter pintle to bore clearance, and a few other non-disclosed features. Take it or leave it. Its a free market.
 
Soup Nazi said:
I am going to change any minds here. I realized that years ago already.

The Mach 4,5, 6 and 7's will start shipping in earnest next week.

They have lighter pintles, low friction DLC coating, tighter pintle to bore clearance, and a few other non-disclosed features. Take it or leave it. Its a free market.
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What is the difference from the Mach7 to Mach8? Are these the AF?
 
Soup Nazi said:
I am going to change any minds here. I realized that years ago already.

The Mach 4,5, 6 and 7's will start shipping in earnest next week.

They have lighter pintles, low friction DLC coating, tighter pintle to bore clearance, and a few other non-disclosed features. Take it or leave it. Its a free market.
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How much are these?
 
Cummalong said:
I'm putting my motor back together and I ran lighting 4s before there to big for just a street truck should I spend the 1200 on lighting3s or is there another good stick around 200hp for a ppump 24v
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Id pm smokem and tell him what you want, he ll get ya squared away.
 
Hey Don I sent you a pm about two weeks ago with no replay. Can you pm me some way of contacting. You. Id like to pick out a set of injectors.
 
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