Looking for 800 or so... Help me (long)

R

RJPotts

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Feb 17, 2013
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Ok. My truck is currently as it is in my sig except for 5k GSK I forgot to put in there. It was my dd, now it's not and I want more power. This is primarily a street toy, may make it to the track a few times a year tops.
I need some suggestions and some advice so I can get a parts list together and get stuff coming. This thing has been neglected too long.
I'm gonna get all my fueling out of the way first so here we go.
-Pump is off and ready to go to a very good local shop. I assume I just need to max/balance it but I wanna know exactly what to tell the pump shop to do.
Do shops like sheid for ex just get all the p&b the same or do they make some hotter/cooler to adjust for the cylinders that are naturally hotter?
This pump shop is very good but I doubt they know all the voodoo and magic tricks that competition oriented diesel shops know and I wanna make sure I can tell them to do it the way it should be done.
-I'm gonna reassemble the afc before I take it in. (Which spring kit do I need? Anything else I need for the afc?)
-need some DV also. 024s and Weston's comps were both recommended to me, which would be better? Or would something else be better?
-I'm planning on ditching these ddp4s for some 5x16 or 5x18 (which would be better?)
-fuel supply will be an issue. A1000 lift pump was suggested to me about 2 yrs ago, what's out there now or is this still a good option?
What about fuel return with whatever pump I go with?
-any other fuel stuff I need that I forgot about?

Air:
Planning on running this silver 62 as a secondary. Which primary? I've been told s475, s480, gt80, s4t. Which would be best matched to my secondary for ~800? Or is there something even better I don't know about?

I guess that's all I can think of now.
Anything else I need or should have??
Thanks for reading my novel in advance.
-R.J.
 
I'd find a shop that is competent and knowledgeable in turning up a pump, instead of going off directions provided by the internet. Something to be said for having experience in doing it.
 
That's an option I guess but this particular shop is very good and can do whatever I tell them. I just dont know what to tell them. What I am after is someone experienced in bench tuning pumps to tell me if its normal to just get all the barrels putting out the exact same volume as close to maxed as possible or if some should put out more than others. Maybe 5&6 put out slightly less since they're inherently hotter.
The shop in question is highly experienced in tuning pumps, I'm not.
I don't want to take my pump in there and tell them to do something that may not work as well as something else.
I might be asking someone to release a secret but I'm curious.
This may even be something that they know and I'm just wasting time wondering but I'd like to know just for the sake of knowing.
 
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If they are experienced in tuning pumps then they shouldn't be listening to you as to what to do to a pump. That's like you the patient telling the operating room Dr where to cut. If you don't have faith in them doing it right then you need to find someone who knows already.
 
go to kevin from northeast diesel he knows what hes doing and for a great price
 
I'm not saying they don't know what to do, I'm saying I don't.
The doctor thing was pretty funny but its not the same at all. You wouldn't take your stock truck to a shop and say I want 400 hp when I come pick it up and turn them loose. You could come get a stock truck with a 200 shot. Yeah that will work but there's a better way to do it.
It's great if they know what to do, you'd expect them to. I want to know what to do and why. For my own experience.
Still a lot more questions I need answered too. I'll worry more about the pump when I get all the other new parts for the pump in hand.
 
I wouldn't take my truck to a dealer asking for a performance rebuild. You shouldn't take your pump to a standard shop and expect a performance pump.
 
RJPotts said:
Ok. My truck is currently as it is in my sig except for 5k GSK I forgot to put in there. It was my dd, now it's not and I want more power. This is primarily a street toy, may make it to the track a few times a year tops.
I need some suggestions and some advice so I can get a parts list together and get stuff coming. This thing has been neglected too long.
I'm gonna get all my fueling out of the way first so here we go.
-Pump is off and ready to go to a very good local shop. I assume I just need to max/balance it but I wanna know exactly what to tell the pump shop to do.
Do shops like sheid for ex just get all the p&b the same or do they make some hotter/cooler to adjust for the cylinders that are naturally hotter?
This pump shop is very good but I doubt they know all the voodoo and magic tricks that competition oriented diesel shops know and I wanna make sure I can tell them to do it the way it should be done.
Click to expand...

They will balance the pump so the cc's are similar, otherwise your idle will be way off and the truck will run like crap down low.

RJPotts said:
-I'm gonna reassemble the afc before I take it in. (Which spring kit do I need? Anything else I need for the afc?)
-need some DV also. 024s and Weston's comps were both recommended to me, which would be better? Or would something else be better?
-I'm planning on ditching these ddp4s for some 5x16 or 5x18 (which would be better?)
-fuel supply will be an issue. A1000 lift pump was suggested to me about 2 yrs ago, what's out there now or is this still a good option?
Click to expand...

Lazer Cut DV's will give more fuel, but 024's are great for street driving. I have 5x18s with 024's on my truck, and at light throttle they are very clean. You can get an A1100 or Eliminator pump, but you'll have to be on your own for your filters. Other than that, you can get twin Air Dogs or a Fass 240.

RJPotts said:
Air:
Planning on running this silver 62 as a secondary. Which primary? I've been told s475, s480, gt80, s4t. Which would be best matched to my secondary for ~800? Or is there something even better I don't know about?

-R.J.
Click to expand...

Honestly, all of them will work. The bigger chargers will come on later.

RJPotts said:
Anything else I need or should have??
Thanks for reading my novel in advance.
-R.J.
Click to expand...

Studs, orings, cam with retainer, more timing, etc.
 
Thank you very much for answering some of my questions JQmile.
That is what I had assumed the answer would be for the pump. Glad that dentist trip is out of the way.
Are ddp 042s (024) the exact same thing as Bosch 024s? I've read til my head hurt about them and some say yes some say no. Any definitive answer?
I know comp usually = full/lc, but I thought Weston's comps still had a lip. Am I wrong?
I was originally planning on running air dog but I saw a lot of people shying away from them for reliability issues. Is this still a problem for some?
Already o-ringed, no studs on garmons advice. Just super torqued factory bolts.
Lots of cams out there. Well cross that bridge later. Is it really necessary for my goal or just helpful at that level?
Timing I can fool with at my leisure. Any specific # I should try first once everything's together?
Factory afc parts good other than springs?
I found a stock plate, which profile should I mill it to? Haven't had one for years.
Thanks again
 
I would run at least 24-ish on timing, although your spool-up tolerance may vary. More timing, worse spooling. With the HP you are looking for, I would at least drill and tap the stock cam, a gear in the front cover sucks, and happens to a lot of people over about 600rwhp.

On a side note, if you're working with Garmon, just do what he says, and stop mucking about on the internet. He's had a successful diesel shop for years for a reason, and my personal experience has been very good with him as well.
 
I know Garmon is good, I've known him for around ten yrs and been through 3 trucks. Only problem is he's over an hour away and very busy. It's hard to get him on the phone long enough to really talk about what I want.
Don't get me wrong, when I dropped my truck off multiple times before and turned him loose without any instruction the result was better than I could have asked for.
All the major stuff to support bigger numbers that requires his magic wand is done and I'm a major DIYer especially on this kind of stuff. I'm a diesel mechanic by trade and can do anything I'll have to do and am going to do all this work myself mostly cause I don't have to pay myself for labor and I'm in no kind of hurry.
I'm just trying to get some good experienced based opinions from people who haven't been out of this game for a while like I have. Like you for example JQmile.
Maybe I need to call Garmon and see what he says. Even though I know his answer will be "bring it down here". :lolly:
Thanks again
 
Okay, I'll be the one with dumb advice. Remove your pump and send it to Kevin at NE Diesel or Seth and have 13mm plungers and barrels installed, but leave the stock pump cam. Make sure it will fuel to a full 4000rpm and use a set of 181dv's for your starting point. You won't have to go big on injectors, or run high timing to make your 800 and a stock cam will be fine. If you go with a moderate sized single you can probably get away with just studs and worry about o-rings if you loose your head gasket. A good pump makes it easy to do and you only have to do it once. Plus it'll run cleaner at a given power level. To make more power, just add fuel and more air
 
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Not dumb advice at all. I'd tossed the idea of a 13mm pump around but thought I could get my goal easy enough without it. But goals change and one day 800 might get boring like whatever I've got now did.
Pump is off, already o-ringed, what's the approx damage to install 13mm p&b & bench + whatever else they may need to do?
 
X2 on northeast diesel , Kevin is a great guy, and puts out a great pump ...
 
RJPotts said:
Not dumb advice at all. I'd tossed the idea of a 13mm pump around but thought I could get my goal easy enough without it. But goals change and one day 800 might get boring like whatever I've got now did.
Pump is off, already o-ringed, what's the approx damage to install 13mm p&b & bench + whatever else they may need to do?
Click to expand...

Best to contact them yourself. I had one built a few years ago and it was about 3K. That included having the cam ground. It isn't cheap, but once done everything becomes easier to accomplish. Be very carefull who you use. My first one was built by CDS and they made a mistake that cost me a years worth of grief. Kevin's will be right on the money first try, and i have heard only good things about Seth as well.
 
Granted, this is about two years ago, but Seth quoted me around $1800 for upgrading to 13mm P&B's.
 
Well unfortunately that's not in the cards right this moment. At least not without the wife offing me in my sleep lol.
Maybe I'll just have them max/balance my pump and buy some 024s for now and sell off some of my junk for more go fast $$$.
I might be entertained enough as is for a while if I can do some tuning too.
I know this is a forum no no sometimes but whose afc spring kit should I get?
Will I need a keyed pump gear once it's maxed?
Keep the suggestions for parts coming please. I'd still like to have a good list once I can throw more money at this thing.
 
Get your current pump maxed and balance by a performance shop (NE and DPE come to mind), throw a s480 under your silver 62, add some SDX comp DVs, 5x18s injectors, run timing in the 20s, throw a retainer on your stock cam. Install a fuel pump that will maintain 45 psi. Use a stock AFC spring and a boost controller on the reference line to set max travel at 60psi or so. And finally, make sure the rest of your parts can handle the build $$$. All of that will put you mid 700s, maybe 800hp, and still be a decent street truck.

That's a little over simplified, but it will get pointed in the right direction.
 
Perfect. That will more than entertain me for quite some time I'm sure.
Few more questions now....
SDX comps still have a lip correct? They're not full cuts???
Where would one go about getting a retainer for the cam gear?
Which s480?
Which pump would you recommend?
Keyed pump gear necessary?
 
Dude. There is literally a metric SH!T ton of info on this forum, with answers to your exact questions. We aren't going to spoon feed you on exactly what S480 you should run on your truck. Grab a chair. Get off your smartphone. Pull up to a computer. START READING.
 
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