my ladder bars

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This is the design I settled on. 1.5" x 0.219 wall DOM, urethane bushings and a front shackle, street strip or sled pulling.
 
Jess@FarmboyFab said:
Those look familiar.



Why are we talking about bending forces? A single bar without an outside force will see compression forces.

Of course DOM is a much better choice for dragging it over rocks, and even so in a traction bar setup. Enough to justify the cost...thats up to the buyer/builder.



I build 1.9"OD x.200" wall SCH80....run by many on this site...we have yet to have a failure. Just some real world experience. DOM would be pimp, but i try to help the customer save where possible.

Nice set of bars btw.
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Didn't you use to have pics of your bars on your site? Have you had good luck with the Johnny Joints? I remember seeing your bars a while back and thinking that they looked great!!
 
Jess@FarmboyFab said:
DOM would be pimp, but i try to help the customer save where possible.

Nice set of bars btw.
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Just checked local pricing (2" Dom vs. 1.5 sch 80 pipe). Dom is roughly $5 more per foot. In a typical single bar setup you'd be looking at a $60-70 difference in price. I'll admit that I didn't even check pipe pricing before I built these.
 
Your bars look great dude! I don't think I missed it but how how long are they?

I didn't think Sch. 80 would suffice, I geuss I am pleasantly wrong! I know I called a steel place close to me and they have to special request 2" DOM and it was only avalaible in full sticks for like $350-$375 a pop!

I might just have to call and get a price on Sch. 80, my truck is basically just a street rig anyway...
 
jlibert said:
Just checked local pricing (2" Dom vs. 1.5 sch 80 pipe). Dom is roughly $5 more per foot. In a typical single bar setup you'd be looking at a $60-70 difference in price. I'll admit that I didn't even check pipe pricing before I built these.
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I don't know where you're from, but if 2" .50 wall (actual) DOM is only $5 a foot more than 1.5" sch 80, either their pipe prices are ridiculous or give me the address of where you're getting it. Around here there's at least a $20 difference per foot.
Of course it isn't stronger, but my whole point is for the price, it's a better choice. Or for that matter, 3x2x.120 wall tubing would be stronger and 1/4 the price.

Farmboy, are you also bigreen?

:edit: Or rather than just throwing more material at it, get smart and do something like in wicked's picture. That traction bar design works better as well.
 
braxton357 said:
I don't know where you're from, but if 2" .50 wall (actual) DOM is only $5 a foot more than 1.5" sch 80, either their pipe prices are ridiculous or give me the address of where you're getting it. Around here there's at least a $20 difference per foot.
Of course it isn't stronger, but my whole point is for the price, it's a better choice. Or for that matter, 3x2x.120 wall tubing would be stronger and 1/4 the price.

Farmboy, are you also bigreen?

:edit: Or rather than just throwing more material at it, get smart and do something like in wicked's picture. That traction bar design works better as well.
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I've never mentioned using .50 wall DOM.
I used .250 wall 2" DOM that was purchased for $10/ft.
1.9 O.D. .200 wall Pipe (1.5" sched. 80) is approximately $5/ft.

Why would you compare .500 wall DOM to .200 wall pipe???

BTW, I'm from Fresno. It's under my avitar.


Lets see pics of your bars.
 
jlibert said:
Didn't you use to have pics of your bars on your site? Have you had good luck with the Johnny Joints? I remember seeing your bars a while back and thinking that they looked great!!
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Our new site will be done this month. It will have new pictures, online store, etc. We have pretty much disabled the current site.

See attached....best i can find at the moment...my pics are spread out everywhere. But nearly identical to yours. My flex joints just have a threaded body, that you can adjust the 'preload' of the inner ball, where it looks like you have the snap-ring style.


Farmboy, are you also bigreen?
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Yes, good to see you over here as well.

Or rather than just throwing more material at it, get smart and do something like in wicked's picture. That traction bar design works better as well.
Click to expand...

A triangulated bar isnt going to be ideal in all situations. In many areas it will be best (like crawling, articulation, lots of wheel travel, etc). However, keep in mind the bending forces (due to the attempted rotation of the axle tube) those bars will see directly in the middle of the tubes, or where ever they meet into one. The upward force is enough to justify pretty large materials (even larger than a single bar in compression), thus becoming more expensive and heavier (and you already have to double the tube quantity).

Undersized material...and poor design (lower bar pushing up on top bar):

http://competitiondiesel.com/forums/showthread.php?t=28532

This, and triangulated pushes up on the framerail slightly (granted, not much, as its at the end of a very long lever arm), leaving the forward pressure to still be exerted through the blocks/leafs ....whereas the single bar pushes forward on the framerail; downfall being that the leafs can pull back and try to flatten. Single bars will actually work better with a flatter spring and bigger block, as it uses the leaf at a top link, and the block as vertical separation. More vertical separation = less pinion angle change.

My price difference on seamless SCH80 and 2"x.25" DOM is slightly more than the $5/ft you were quoted.
 

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All the trucks we have running these make big power, easily in excess of 1200 ft. lbs. of torque, no one has ever bent any yet. If they didn't work I wouldn't sell them. Also to put a rest to the debate, maximum force through torque multiplication was formulated and these were run by a CAD engineer, he determined the placement for the cross brace. He also used our templates to CAD the brakets for the shop who does our laser cutting. We also implemented a minimized weld, where the brackets attach to the housing. Since he works with this stuff everyday, and also has real world experiece I trust him completely.

The only problem we ever had with the design was the bushing on the upper bar, we have since revised them.

I am not trying to be defensive or knock anyone elses product or design, but can easily see the downfalls of a single bar. The front shacke in our bars will allow for full suspension movement, and still maintain pinion angle. When we used these type bars on race cars with leaf springs, we used a housing floater with a single front heim to allow for pivoting. Since we cannot use a housing floater a shackle serves the same purpose.
 
WICKEDDIESELS said:
I wouldn't sell them.
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I did not realize that this was a product you sell, I had no intent to make judgment of another vendors' product. That's not my game. I apologize. I wish you future good fortune as well.




And as far as single vs. triangulated, there are clearly pros and cons to each...both have their place. I dont recommend any person to solely listen to a bias vendor's viewpoint (myself included).
 
What calc do you want to perform?

Material ultimate strength or yield strengh has ALMOST nothing to do with stiffness in a column element. Compressive strength and resistance to buckling (mainly a geometric property of mas distribution) are the dictating criteria unless you want to TRY and appoximate side loading for those occasional boulders in the way.
 
Jess@FarmboyFab said:
I did not realize that this was a product you sell, I had no intent to make judgment of another vendors' product. That's not my game. I apologize. I wish you future good fortune as well.




And as far as single vs. triangulated, there are clearly pros and cons to each...both have their place. I dont recommend any person to solely listen to a bias vendor's viewpoint (myself included).
Click to expand...

I built that display for the family room, the wife didn't like it. She said it clashed with the couch. LOL! Actually we built it to take to the truck pulls, most of the top finishing trucks in our area pulls have these. Most gained alot of feet with them. Also to point out their are a few trucks with the single bar setup who pull just as well. The difference is, they remove theirs to drive home.

Sorry, I didn't post that picture to actually promote the sell of the bars, just to offer building options to you guys. DOM has went up so much, that they really aren't profitable to make anymore.
 
Installed the bars this weekend. Night and day difference on the road. I can't really say that the quality of the ride is any stiffer or more harsh. I have noticed a BIG difference in the handling over rough roads, expansion joints, rail road tracks, etc. Tires stay planted to the ground now!

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jlibert said:
Installed the bars this weekend. Night and day difference on the road. I can't really say that the quality of the ride is any stiffer or more harsh. I have noticed a BIG difference in the handling over rough roads, expansion joints, rail road tracks, etc. Tires stay planted to the ground now!

cp3019.jpg

cp3018.jpg

cp3016.jpg

cp3014.jpg

cp3015.jpg
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could you tell me were you got those brackets that you used to weld on the axle and the ones on the frame . thanks
 
i have alwyas wondered why there is a need for traction bars tht extend all the way to the front of the cab. could someone enlighten me on this it just not sparking in my brain why you would need one so long.
thanks in advance,
andy
 
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