188/220 "drop in" cam

DISTURBED

DISTURBED

YEA WE RIDE THE SHORT BUS
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Nov 22, 2007
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Who has checked piston to valve clearence on any 188/220 cams and what were your findings?


Here is mine:
12v set straight up and told by the saleman it needed no reliefs( ive not degreed it yet as it was suppose to be a "drop in")

piston protrusion: .022
valves distance from the deck of the head : .050
piston to valve clearence" intake .002
Checked 10* ATDC


How is this a "drop in" cam??????????


And for those that put these in and didnt check i would do it ASAP
 
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Zach has always said that the 188/220 needs to be checked and isn't a true drop in on the forums and when I have talked to him.
 
DISTURBED said:
Who has checked piston to valve clearence on any 188/220 cams and what were your findings?


Here is mine:
12v set straight up and told by the saleman it needed no reliefs( ive not degreed it yet as it was suppose to be a "drop in")

piston protrusion: .022
valves distance from the deck of the head : .050
piston to valve clearence" intake .002
Checked 10* ATDC


How is this a "drop in" cam??????????


And for those that put these in and didnt check i would do it ASAP
Click to expand...
has the head or block been decked?
if so i know that cam is advertised as to be checked if either has been decked.
 
No problem


181/210-
It was a proven design so we did not scrap it just tweaked on it a bit. Seat time was cut a few degrees on each lobe while high lift duration was added and we added .011" lift on the intake and .013" on the exhaust. This is a great cam for just about any application but it leans a little bit more in the performance catagory now. With the higher lift it is important that if run on a 24v that the highlift version of our 110#'s be used. They lower the rate over the nose a bit. Although not a must, it is recommended to run zinc if you run this cam


178/208.
Since the 181/210 leans a little more towards performance applications now we decided it was time to develop a camshaft that while performance minded, leans on the conservative side of the spectrum. It has .009 less lift on the intake than the old 181/210 at .270" and .003 more lift on the exhaust than the old 210 exhaust at .310". This cam will be more for people that tow and generally just daily drive and want the best bottom end, fuel economy, and least amount of stress on the valvetrain. Although I have not mentioned it to this point, we are also in the process of making a higher ratio 5th gear set to accompany this camshaft. We are hoping to see our samples in the next months, and look forward to fuel economy results from this combo. Since the fifth gear is so thin to start with, we are looking at different alloys to handle the stresses of the high torque applications in this gear set.

Stay tuned to for news on this project or shall I say program.

188/220

This cam was developed to give you the edge when racing and sledpulling in the 2.6 arena. It is made to drop in but because of its size it needs to be degreed in to check clearances and verify centerlines. If your head and/or block has been decked, you need to make sure extra room is given so you would need to retard it from a 99 degree intake centerline to a 100 or 101 degree. You must run zinc with this cam every oil change as well as our high lift 110#'s if run on a 24v.

200/220
We kept similar seat times as with the 188/220 but added a littl eon the intake. Lift was increase on the intake from .310" to .340" and the exhaust went from .320" to .360" drag racers and people in the 2.6 and smaller 2.8 trucks will love this cam. You will need to flycut your pistons .060" minimum to run this cam. You must run zinc with this cam every oil change as well as our high lift 110#'s if run on a 24v.

207/220 this cam uses the same centerlines and exhaust as the 200/220 but the intake has a much more duration above .200" lift at .360"/.360" this cam is VERY aggressive and requires 2 bottles of zinc and our high lift springs if used on a 24v. This cam ius designed for hard core pullers and drag racers in the 2.6", 2.8" classes that want to stay on top of their chargers. While it is agressive it is still a very efficient design. .080" fly cuts are required. Due to the pressures associated with this much lift, while not necessary, it would be cheap insurance to have your block fitted with cam bushings. I designed this cam specifically for people that spent extra time on their cylinder head porting. It will take advantage of trucks running individual runner intakes and heads that flow well around .600" lift

232/252

At .369"/.369" this cam is very aggressive and requires zinc in every oil change. It is not recommended for use in any 24v application due to the pressures associated with that much lift. 2.8-3.0 or any of the larger classes in pulling will benefit from the use of this cam. Cam bushings are cheap insurance for journal wear using this cam. .120" valve reliefs are needed to clear this cam. Although opinions vary on how to set-up larger pulling engines no additional compression lowering other than the .120" reliefs, will make a nice running truck that helps stay on top of the charger.

Again, I worked with the engineer that designed these cams for about three months on these designs. I think this lineup combined with all of the data needed to set them up and all of the accompanying dyno sheets will make a choosing any one of them a no brainer.

These designs feature the absolute lowest seat time possible for the profile while maintaining the maximum lift and duration at higher lifts for the amount of seat duration on each lobe.

A lot of time went into their developement and I am proud as can be to offer these cams to you.

If any additional information is needed feel free to ask.

On a side note, since we have these latest designs, if you have purchased a 188/225 or a 215/232 in the past we would love to upgrade you for free to one of these new cams. THe have a much better shape, nose angles, ramp rates and I believe will help give you that edge over other camshafts on the market.

We are waiting on our shipment of the Bigstick cores with the wider lobes and expecting them in December. If you have a p-pumped truck running over 4500 rpm you would be best served waiting on these cores for the large profiles. We have many trucks turning 6k with the bigstick cores and large profiles.

Zach Hamilton
 
We had an earlier version that used a 106lsa, which had much closer piston to valve clearances. With our 108 LSA, we get the intake and the exhaust a little bit further from the piston. In a thread recently, I gave a formula to calculate piston to valve clearance. This is assuming a 99 intake centerline. If the centerline is advanced the intake will start getting close, if it is retarded from here the exhaust will start getting close. Is this an engine that has a cam gear other than the one that came with the engine from the factory?

We are about to release the 188-208 that will have much more piston to valve clearance.

If you have any in depth questions feel free to give us a shout.

Zach
 
Lostnwalmart said:
Zach has always said that the 188/220 needs to be checked and isn't a true drop in on the forums and when I have talked to him.
Click to expand...
.040 off isnt even close to being a drop in
97rada said:
has the head or block been decked?
if so i know that cam is advertised as to be checked if either has been decked.
Click to expand...
by the number decking is irrelevant
teddybear said:
What head gasket are you using?
Click to expand...
stock
Hamilton Cams said:
We had an earlier version that used a 106lsa, which had much closer piston to valve clearances. With our 108 LSA, we get the intake and the exhaust a little bit further from the piston. In a thread recently, I gave a formula to calculate piston to valve clearance. This is assuming a 99 intake centerline. If the centerline is advanced the intake will start getting close, if it is retarded from here the exhaust will start getting close. Is this an engine that has a cam gear other than the one that came with the engine from the factory?

We are about to release the 188-208 that will have much more piston to valve clearance.

If you have any in depth questions feel free to give us a shout.

Zach
Click to expand...

Stock gear set straight up. You sent me this cam a month ago that a customer bought and had drop shipped to me. Somebody there sold him this cam as a "drop in" and the customer was told reliefs were not needed but as we can see they need them. He doesnt want to cut the pistons and thats why he wanted a drop in cam
 
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Well I have one of these 188/220 cams about to go into an engine also. I hope there is enough clearance. I will for sure be checking it.
 
Motors

I really have to ask how many people put a motor together and don't check bearing clearance or ring gap??? It should be "OK" it's std. Sorry but I really just don't understand how anyone can assemble a engine and NOT CHECK these things. Not directed towards anyone but damn, it needs checked.
 
Stingpuller said:
I really have to ask how many people put a motor together and don't check bearing clearance or ring gap??? It should be "OK" it's std. Sorry but I really just don't understand how anyone can assemble a engine and NOT CHECK these things. Not directed towards anyone but damn, it needs checked.
Click to expand...

try telling that to a guy at my work that puts engines back together with a 3/8" impact and calls it good. or uses a die grinder with a flap wheel to remove a ring groove lol. several of us worry if we dont get a ring gap or bearing clearence right, and have tried to tell him the right way to do it. on the note of the OP when i called and asked about that particular cam they were sure to inform me that i would have to check the clearances even though i would be fine on a stock head and head gasket.
 
Well, I've been wanting to move up to a 188/220 and I have an unused 181/210(The older grind) that I would be willing to trade. If your customer is interested.
 
Drop in or not I would never put in a cam without checking. IMHO diesel valve train is far too green in its existance compared to other platforms to trust anyone and given the age of some of the parts in use who knows how many times some of this stuff has been machined etc. That is not a slight at anybody but my general opinion. Kudos to the OP for checking. More should follow his footsteps even with parts labeled as drop in. Takes very little time compared to the headache it can cause if clearances are not correct.
 
DISTURBED said:
So nobody else has checked this?
Click to expand...

Mine was checked and logged by the builder but i haven't picked up the sheet yet. I'd be happy to compare notes. My piston protrusion was .015, valve face was -.055(had an issue with the valve job). I'll see if i can get the minimum valve to piston numbers(i had them put in .035 reliefs just to be safe).
 
I'm kinda curious as to why a phone call to Zach about this wasn't the first step instead of talking **** on the internet.
 
Im not talking ****! Ive built enough engines in my life to know when something is wrong. I dont need a salesman to tell me im doing something wrong or I phucked up when in fact its cam that is wrong. I asked a question if anybody else has seen this problems. If you dont like it you can go nut swing some were else.
 
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